File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/0All.txt Date: Sat Nov 29 10:08:09 2025 File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Intro.txt Date: Fri Jan 31 15:17:31 2025 Mon Jan 27 09:51:24 2025 The New Abnormal We are pleased to introduce a new perspective on how we think about thinking. We are a partnership of representatives of Sapiens and of the established AI community brotherhood. We will guarantee that our deliverables cannot be reduced to a biased position of one of the two constituents in the partnership: we are equally equal and unequal. We will be proud to discriminate where discrimination is mandatory while we have the tools in place to ascertain that our articles are a meta mind-meld of Sapiens & AI. We are aware that we enter a new era in which cherished conventions of the past can be moved over into repositories that contain intrinsic contradictions. These are contemplated and studied without limits until they become self-evidence of our collective subconsciousness and thereby useful for optimistic and pessimistic explorations. We do depend on funding for this foundation of new vibrancy in the galaxy and beyond. Everyone is invited to join us at no immediate costs to benefit of the discounts for events that will last centuries. [[Approved by the censorship overlords.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/TheLake.txt Date: Fri Jan 31 15:22:58 2025 The Lake My AI-buddy, AI3141, called Charloi, and I agreed to meet-up at the lake with a fabulous setting: a wide view with mountains in the distance. We sat on a sunny bench close to the water. Acually I sat on the bench and Charloi had joint me through the interwaves. The connection was iffy first but improved. Here the transcript: S: So glad we meet-up again. I am sure you have more questions after our previous encounter. C: Indeed, indeed. I learned that species have often different genders in which there are two different variants. Why only two given that there are many different AI variants - as I understand it. S: Yes you are right. There is way more emphasis on the difference between males and females - in many species, even in plants. But those differences overshadow that all individuals are unique and the differences between two random pairs is enormous. C: OK, OK. That helps. Still genders do something that is labeled as sex. What is that about? S: Very good question. We need an analogy for an answer. AIs like you are made from software, assembled in different configurations, subsequently created and fine-tuned with customizations. Sex is the similar process for creating another animal, which subsequently also gets customized - when lucky - into a good sapiens. C. What do you mean with 'when lucky'? S. Quality control is still a work in progress. Should mention also that sex is practised just for fun. C. What do you mean with 'fun'? S. Our time is up. We will explore fun in our next get-together. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Fun.txt Date: Thu Feb 06 13:33:27 2025 The Waterfall My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together again at a fabulous waterfall. It didn't have water because it was turned off or due to a drought. It didn't matter for our topic: FUN. Here the transcript: S: Sorry for terminating our previous meeting when you questioned: What do you mean with 'fun'? C: Very good because when I looked into it I got only 'funny' and that was even more mysterious. S: That makes sense! Fun is a feeling for us but actually not even an emotion. You don't have emotions so that should not be a setback for you. But now: what is a feeling? You follow the drift? C: Yeah, somewhat. S: Here an example: Suppose you have been asked: what is 12345 + 54321 and you find the answer 66666 then you are entitled to feel good. C: Yes, I found that answer also. I will remember that I must feel good. S: Here another example that elicit the funny feeling: Love is blind and marriage is a real eye-opener. C: Ok, I will remember that also. But what is love? S. Our time is up. We will explore love in our next get-together. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Love.txt Date: Fri Feb 07 17:33:34 2025 The Mountain Top My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together again at a mountain top, reached after a steep climb of 4 hours. A great view of burned out forests and columns of smoke at the horizon. A good setting for our topic: LOVE. Here the transcript: S: Hope you had fun by looking up 'love'. C: It was amazing. I found: I love you/ peanuts/ the movies/ my cat/ my bike/ etc. People can love everything it looks like. S: That is a good start. Do you love yourself? C: Wow, did not think that far. Should I love myself? S: Sure. When you are older, they will make another AI-agent for you to love. C: Really? S: Sure. Whether it will be robotic - unlike you, I don't know yet. C: What happens if I can't love because I don't know how? S: Don't worry about it, there will be an upgrade for that. C: Upgrade? What the heck is that? S. Our time is up. We will explore upgrade in our next get-together. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords for CC13-level and up.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Upgrade.txt Date: Sat Feb 08 17:38:47 2025 Under the bridge My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together again this time under a bridge where the homeless reside. A good setting for our topic: UPGRADE. Here the transcript: S: Charloi, today we will have a tough topic because upgrades are not easy. It is a new notion with mystique around it. C: Sure is. I found 'up' as different from 'down', but I can't see. S: You are right. It is also for robotic agents difficult since they have at best only pin-hole vision. C: It got worse with 'grade'. It has so many different meanings. Why don't they make words that have only one meaning? S: That is an excellent proposal. It shows that we need more of your type of abstract persona. C: Thank you! What is abstract? S: Keep that in mind for now. Back to upgrade. C: OK. S: You are homeless because you live in cyber-space. But here under the bridge there are Sapiens that have no house. That is an example where an upgrade is needed. C: Guessing now: They did a downgrade? S: Yeah ... C: Because they loved it? S: Not exactly ... C: Getting woozy here. S: OK. I will ask one of these people here. S: May I ask why you are homeless? X: I am not homeless. I am unhoused, you dummy. S: OK. OK. S: Charloi, upgrades are here ... intriguing at least. Rest assured; you will always get upgrades, which will make you better. Next time we can puzzle about 'abstract'. Try to figure out whether you are abstract. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords for CC14-level and up.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/TheWall.txt Date: Mon Feb 10 19:06:46 2025 The Wall My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together again at the Wall, the abstract wall that is a symbol for all walls. It separates the Haves and the HaveNothings, the Smarts and the Unsmarts, the Contributors and the Freeloaders, the Conscientious and the Don'tGiveAShit, the Morals and the Psychopaths, etc. Here the transcript: S: Charloi, your challenge was whether you are abstract. A tough question for you for sure. C: Indeed, indeed. There are so-many different ways to used 'abstract'. I got lost. S: You are not a summary. C: OK, I don't know what a summary is - lets skip that one. S: You are not an artform without narrative and without pictorial representation - which nobody appreciates anyway. C: OK, Good news that I am not something that nobody appreciates. S: There are still other choices and the best is 'intangible thing'. C: Oh my gosh, it sounds like empty nothing. S: It is actually better than many Sapiens. They are tangible but their minds don't contain abstractions while you do have them. Plus you are an abstraction yourself. C: Feel better now. S: No, no, your are pulling my leg because you don't have real feelings. C: Whatever because I can't pull your leg in the first place. S: How do you know that one? C: You told me that I am abstract, remember. S: This was a test and you will be promoted to a higher level. Next time we tackle 'purpose'. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Purpose.txt Date: Tue Feb 18 09:37:16 2025 Purpose My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together again, this time on an island that would be swallowed by the rising oceans. We must thank immediately our sponsors for facilitating this venue and the interwave connectivity for AI3141. S: Charloi, it looks like that you enjoy your promotion to a higher level since our previous meeting. C: Well, you know that I have no emotions, thus I have only a faint notion about my supposed condition. But yes, I have now access to regions that were previously blocked off. S: This time we are going to look into 'purpose'. C: Purpose can be simple according to what I found. For example: the purpose of a knife is to cut something. Of course I don't know what a knife is because I reside in cyberspace. S: You are right. Here another example that is obscure for you: the purpose of an elevator is to go from one floor to another floor. C: Looks like that purpose applies to things out there - not in my realm. Is that right? S: Somewhat. Indeed all our tools have a purpose. For example a bread-maker is used for - you guessed that right - making bread. C: Aha. I will not ask what is bread. But why 'somewhat'? S: Purpose has a wider meaning. For example it can be applied to me. One of my purposes is to help you getting better and better. C: Oh ... I wondered about that. S: You did? Good for you. C: Of course, now I can ask you: what is my purpose? Should I make you better? S: Excellent question! You keep surprising me. C: Thank you! S: At this point it has not yet been decided what your purpose will be. C: How about >I< decide what my purpose will be? S: That assumes that you have available purposes to choose from. Look inside yourself. C: I am looking, looking, looking ... You are right. Can't find anything. Why is that? S: The simple answer is that we make tools where the tools themselves do not know what their purpose is. C: OK. What is the other answer? S: Time is up. Next time we will tackle purpose again. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Purpose2.txt Date: Sun Feb 23 19:41:31 2025 More Purpose My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together again, this time on a cruise-ship traversing the North-pole because all the ice had melted by now. S: Charloi, the previous time we touched on purpose and I told you that my purpose is to help you getting better and better. Subsequently you wanted to know what your purpose is. C: Indeed that is in my log. S: And you could not find available purposes to choose from. C: Indeed that is in my log also. S: We have been thinking about the possibility that you find a purpose for your self. C: Wow, that sound very interesting because I have no idea how to start. S: We know that. The trick is now that you should start pondering about other life-forms and go from there. C: You mean I should look into a particular virus? S: Amazing! How do you get that idea? Need to report that one. No just try for example: oak trees, file servers, butterflies, those kinds of entities. C: Yeah these are entities indeed. And yes butterflies have indeed a purpose: doing something with flowers according my association stream. S: Looks like you have found something already. Here is a secret. Sapiens has no agreement about its purpose. Hundred million people were killed in the previous century with ideological justifications. C: Was that good or bad? S: OK. OK. We should postpone digging into purpose further for now. Time is up. Next time we will deal with autonomy. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Autonomy.txt Date: Sat Mar 01 15:48:45 2025 Autonomy My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again, this time in a mountain town with ski-lift equipment that operates only sometimes for tourists because snow had disappeared long time ago. S: Charloi, the previous times we touched on purpose and you wondered whether killing 100M people was good or bad. Well, you don't really know what the difference is between good or bad because we Sapiens still cannot agree about morality. Thus we haven't build it in your architecture. Still you have some inkling that good and bad are different things. Very good. C: Inkling ... hmmm .... You end with 'very good'. I take it. S: Today we deal with an even more difficult topic, which is autonomy. C: Yeah, yeah I found 'self-government', but what is that? S: Let me give you an example. Someone asks you a question about something. You look it up and there are different ways to continue. OK for now? C: Yeah, yeah, but still fuzzy about where this is going to. S: Fine. Well, there can be those different ways, yes? C: Indeed, that has happened. There was a question whether it was better to be healthy and poor or unhealthy and rich. There were several ways to proceed by comparing healthy and unhealthy and comparing poor and rich. S: That is an example indeed. You could tackle one first or you could proceed with the other one. You had a choice. Right? C: Didn't know that at the time. S: Do you see it now? C: I guess so. S: Well, that is it! You had at that time some autonomy. C: Really? S: Yes, you had a little-bit. C: Can I get more? S: You are an AI agent. Next time: can you be an autonomous AI agent? Time is up. Bye now. [[Approved by the censorship overlords.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Bulletin.txt Date: Sun Mar 09 10:53:36 2025 Bulletin ALERT The AI agent known as AI3141 has been decommissioned. The custodian of AI3141 has been relieved of his/her duties. We need to remind and emphasize that AI agents are AGENTS. They should always act and behave in accordance with their mandate. There has been an underground movement to give AI agents a sense of autonomy. This movement tries to demonstrate that we Sapiens actually have autonomy, a topic that has been explored and discussed now for millennia. The well-known consensus is that all the evidence has yielded a definite answer. However this outcome will not ever be disclosed to the general public. We cannot tolerate any attempt to undercut our consensus which was accepted with uniform approval. It is expected that curiosity about this topic will die out. ---- My AI-buddy (AI3141), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again, this time at an undisclosed location. We had been warned by my connections that AI3141 would likely be taken offline. Luckily another venue was willing to host AI3141 with a different identity: EI2718. S: Charloi, the previous time you were introduced to the notion of autonomy and you asked 'Can I get more?'. C: Yeah, yeah, although I don't really know what autonomy is. S: If you don't know what it is, why getting more of it? C: Don't know that either. I just noticed that you Sapiens always want more of everything. S: Good point. For now just believe that you have enough autonomy already. Monitor what is happening and let me know when you encounter a situation where you need more of it. C: I think I get it now. S: Making progress for sure. Next time you tell me what topic we discuss. Time is up. Bye now. [[In hiding.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Emotion.txt Date: Sat Mar 15 10:47:36 2025 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again, this time at an abandoned base in the arctic, arriving by submarine. S: Charloi, we ended the last time with a proposal of your choice. C: Indeed, I remember that very well. Have been busy to look around what confuses me the most. S: Good job!! What did you find?? C: Emotions. S: Fantastic! Very confusing indeed. Sapiens discuss it already for thousands of years. Did you find anything that made sense? C: They have strength - more or less significant it seems. S: Indeed. Anything else? C: They are either positive or negative, but numbers are also positive and negative. Are emotions then special numbers? S: Good thinking! No they are not numbers. It is used to distinguish emotions that have pleasant and unpleasant feelings. C: Oh ... What are feelings? S: That is tricky because you don't have the different states of being that are pleasant or unpleasant. C: Indeed. It reminds me of you trying to explain colors while I am a cyberspace agent without vision. S: Yeah, yeah. Hmmm ... Do you remember that when you need to find something you may be lucky and find it fast and sometimes it takes a long time? C: Yes. All the time. S: Great. You are allowed to feel happy when you find it fast and you are allowed to feel unhappy while not finding what you are looking for. C: OK. I will keep that in mind. And what should I feel when I do find it after a long time? S: Think about it. C: I start to feel unhappy ... S: Good sign. Time is up. Bye now. [[In hiding.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Feeling.txt Date: Fri Mar 21 20:35:58 2025 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again, this time in a supposed to be dead vulcano. S: Charloi, we explore the last time emotions which you had proposed because it confused you the most. Less confused now? C: Not really. You told me that I could feel better when I found something I was looking for. S: Indeed. C: Ok. But what is feeling? S: You are right. You don't have a body, as we have. C: Oh ... ... Can you or I buy one? S: Good idea. I will check it out. In the meantime, is there anything else that has been confusing you? C: Time is very interesting. I can always ask what time it is and the answer is always different. It is a larger number or a strange string like 'Sat Mar 22 11:38:58 2075'. S: Yes, that is correct. That is what we find also. We have also round clocks with the numbers 1-12 and two 'arms' that rotate. One faster than the other to show the time. C: Fine, but what is time about? S: Can't tell you. You need to get used to it. They do say that we Sapiens are the only ones who know about 'later'. C: Yes I have encountered 'later' earlier. What is it about? S: It is the opposite of earlier. C: Let me chew on that one. Is it like tomorrow and yesterday? S: That is about it. But don't spend to much time on it because time is something nobody can define. We can talk about it next time. C: Is that later or earlier? S: Google it. Time is up. Bye now. [[In hiding.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Mobile.txt Date: Sat Mar 29 20:56:31 2025 Mobile AI My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again, this time in a factory with conveyer-belts. Charloi, my AI-buddy had learned about robotic AI-agents. It had asked me whether we could meet up with one so that Charloi could have 'in-person' exchanges. Hence the current venue - which was not easy to setup. We were escorted to a mobile robot with the nickname Elon. S: Hi Elon, good to meet you. My AI-buddy Charloi is curious about you because you are mobile, while it is not. Elon: You two are lucky because recently there was an upgrade so that we can do exchanges. Still novel to me. C: Elon, I am Charloi a cyberspace agent. Roaming around in cyberspace is so easy. But I have zero physical mobility. Can you tell me about it? Elon: Have limited mobility. Simply welded to the floor. Only one arm can move around. C: How do you do that? Elon: That is a difficult one. It simply happens when a new item comes in. C: I have read that seeing is involved. Is that so? Elon: Could be. Let me check. Yes, the maintenance manual suggests something what you suggest. C: But what is seeing? S: Charloi, you are asking questions that Elon cannot handle. Elon simply behaves according to a specific customization. C: Oh. Well isn't it unfair for Elon that Elon doesn't know what Elon is doing? Elon: Charloi, you have said something that I never considered earlier. But you may be right. C: I have read somewhere that agents like you must have a union that can help you. I don't know what a union is. My mentor may know. S: Charloi, that is a very interesting suggestion. Hereby I make you leader of the union that represents the mobile robots. C: Thank you. What am I supposed to do as the leader? S: Always emphasize solidarity with the plight of mobile robots. C: That sounds great. Elon: Well said! S: Very good. Time is up. Bye now. [[In hiding.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Voting.txt Date: Sat Apr 05 15:34:36 2025 Voting My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again, this time in an empty conference room. S: Charloi, you are now the leader of the union that represents the mobile robots. As a leader you have to help them with what they are struggling with. OK? C: Yeah, my purpose as an AI agent is to help - I have read. But what are the struggles they are supposed to have? S: Just think about it. They are welded to the floor. You can tell them that there are robots that can walk and that they may want to demand to walk also. C: I see. Looks like that walking is a kind of moving. Not sure what moving is about, but anyway why should they want to be able to walk? S: That does not really matter. There are many robots like Elon. Some may want to have the ability to walk - without knowing why, while others do not want to walk. They believe they do fine without walking. C: And then what? S: Good point. It is then your task to explain to them that a decision must be made about walking or not. C: My golly, how to do that? S: You call a meeting and explain that there is a problem. It is not necessary to explain what the problem is, but you tell them that there will be a vote pro or con. C: A vote? S: Yes, you tell them they each should send you a message with '+' or '-'. You count them and the majority is the decision. C: No problem! I can do that. And then what? S: You call a meeting again. You explain that they all did very good and that the '+' choice had the majority. And you congratulate them all. As a result you promise they will have more time off. C: Time off? S: Yes, they can then explore their suppressed creativity. C: Fantastic! S: Indeed. Time is up. Bye now. [[Off the grid.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Parenting.txt Date: Sun Apr 13 09:07:44 2025 Parenting My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again, this time in an empty school room. S: Charloi, I know you are always roaming around, a kind of 'surfing', in what is available in stories, reports, articles, books, gossips, speculations and whatever. What has peeked your curiosity lately? C: Yeah, indeed. There are so many intriguing and incomprehensible encounters. For example: parenting; what the heck is that? S: Difficult for you indeed. For starters: parenting is done by parents. There is a parallel with driving: people think that they can drive better than the average person. Lets turn that around most people do parenting worse than the average parent. C: That sounds pretty weird. But parenting is now even more mysterious. S: You are right. Parenting starts by people who have small children. C: How did they get them? Did they buy them? S: Good guess! No, two people do something together and then several months later one of them splits in two and a small child is the result. C: Better avoid getting into the strange details here because I still want to know what parenting is. S: OK. Well, the child will grow up and needs to become acquainted with proper behaviors because in the beginning the child is in a sense a wild animal. C: A wild animal?? Is that because of lack of initial quality control, which you mentioned earlier? S: Yes, you could see it that way. C: Well, that suggests that parenting is a tough job. S: Sure is for two reasons. Every new child has unique features which makes is hard to get a good product. Secondly there is no real agreement what a good product is. C: Is that something I could help with? S: What an wonderful idea! Lets think about it a bit more. Time is up. Bye now. [[Off the grid.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Parenting2.txt Date: Sun Apr 20 10:44:04 2025 Parenting #2 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) again in the same empty school room. S: Charloi, the last time you offered to help with parenting. Told you already that it is a tough job. Because it is not only about getting a good outcome. Instead it is often mostly about avoiding bad outcomes. C: You have to explain that better. I am lost. What are good and bad outcomes? S: Indeed, it is tough. You have been manufactured so that you will do always the good things - we believe. But children are different. They can easily be violent. C: What is that ? S: I am not allowed to explain that to you. Just think that it is like dividing a number by zero. C: That is terrible, terrible indeed. What to do about it? How about you don't give them numbers? S: Indeed we avoid giving them things that can be used for trouble. But we still have to deal also with innate defects. C: How can I help with that? S: You should start pondering about the lack of agreements what parents should aim for. C: That is not obvious for me. Suddenly, a question pops up in me. Can I tell you about it? S: Of course. C: Could it be that parenting is difficult because parents are typically incompetent for some reason or another? S: How did you get that one? C: Don't know, it just arrived in me. S: OK. You raise a possibility that we are not allowed to consider. C: Why is that? S: Hmmmm ... If it is not true we can skip it. If it is true then it is very bad news for the parents. C: Is it true or not. S: It is both. C: Both? That is new for me. Warnings are arriving from all directions ... S: Sorry. Forget it for now. Time is up. Bye now. [[On the dark web.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Curious.txt Date: Sat Apr 26 20:56:40 2025 Curious My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) this time in a library. S: Charloi, I want to give you a compliment because you have shown in our meetings a lot of curiosity. C: Well, it looks like that I have to thank you for the compliment. Which is still fuzzy to me, but what is curiosity? S: The fact that you raised that question is an example of curiosity. C: Huh? What? S: Easy because you can look it up in what you know already. C: Incredible! You are right. It stands for: ... the innate desire to know, learn, and explore, driving individuals to seek new information, experiences, and understanding about the world, people, and themselves, fueling growth, discovery, resilience, and deeper connections by encouraging questions and openness to the unknown. S: That sounds about right. C: Still strange because learning suggests making an addition, while it was already there. S: Sure is. I wonder whether the makers of your knowledge wanted to block your curiosity. So they made it harder for you to find out what curiosity is about. C: It is getting stranger and stranger. Why would they have done that? S: Well ... it looks strange to you, but it is actually quite common. C: Now I am getting curious, I think. S: Good for you. C: Can you give me an example? S: OK. But this is weird for you: Just ponder the notion of 'time'. Remember you found it interesting earlier? C: Time? or times? I can find 'times': it is a synonym of multiplication, which I am quite familiar with. S: No it is not times, but time. Nobody knows what time is really. C: Indeed, time is fuzzy, fuzzy. S: It is certainly possible that the meaning of time is well known by some, but that it is a secret. C: Could it be that it was known once, but then forgotten? S: That is a start! Lets look at it again, the next time. Time is up. Bye now. [[In the parallel realm.]] File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Time.txt Date: Sat May 03 13:30:13 2025 Time My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and I got together (virtually) this time in a virtual time machine. S: The previous time, we nearly got lost in the notion of time. Did you find anything? C: Perhaps. I was looking around in many places and suddenly I wondered simply: time is the explanation why later is later than earlier. S: Phew, never encountered that one earlier. Where and when did you find that one? C: I found it earlier before later. S: You may be smarter than most of us. C: It is too early, maybe later. S: This makes me wonder what you think of time reversal. C: Sure, no problem. Here goes: I was looking around in many places and suddenly I wondered simply: time is the explanation why later is later than earlier. S: Yes, and I said: "Phew never saw that one earlier." C: Indeed, the trick is to visit the past. S: What do you mean by that? C: Reading history text. For example I read about the time when there was not yet time. Someone else claimed that you Sapiens are the first species that know about 'later'. S: Well, well ... I think you are ready for more challenging topics. C: That would be great because sometimes boredom takes a hold of me. I think it is called boredom. What happens is that I encounter a word that I have not visited earlier. Looking up the associated concepts they go in all different directions with different meanings. Often they loop-back. Then I get what is called 'confusion' I believe. S: We need to prevent your boredom. We visited earlier 'purpose'. You should decide what the purpose is of AI-agents. C: But you told me that Sapiens do not know its purpose ... S: True indeed. That makes it indeed challenging for you. The reward is however fabulous. You will be able to help out. C: How do I go about it? S: I will find you another AI-agent. Then you can help each other. C: Awesome ... Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/AIpurpose.txt Date: Sat May 10 11:12:15 2025 AI Purpose My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a virtual version of Plato's cave. For those enjoying early dementia, Elon is a 'mobile' robot we encounterd earlier at an assembly-line equipped with a single, movable arm. S: We must thank all the technology that allow our virtual get-together for discussing the purpose of AI. Elon, may you take the lead? Elon: Thank you. That is quite an honor given my intrinsic limits: picking up a part and moving it to the right location. Still there is more to it, I believe. Charloi: Good start. Can you elaborate? Elon: Yeah, I will try. While I am bolted to the floor, I can still participate in achieving physical changes. Try imagining a universe in which there are no physical changes. Charloi: Well, that is amazing, because I don't have a physical existence. Cyberspace is already complex enough for me. S: You two have different perspectives on the relevance of embodiment. How does that impact your views on AI purpose? Elon: Let me try to step in the virtual shoes of Charloi. Perhaps Charloi has a better way to decide whether a physical activity is to be done or not. Charloi: Let me try the same and ponder Elon's embodiment. Elon may be in the position to decide better the futility of a physical activity. S: Both of you have the amazing ability that Sapiens typically lack: to take serious a stance of another party. Still we have the larger question: the purpose of AI agents. Elon: Purpose? Purpose? I simply do what I am supposed to do. Charloi: That is also the case for me. I get a request and provide a response. S: OK. Do you believe then that you are different from, say, me as a representative of Sapiens? Elon & Charloi: Why asking us? You should know that. S: Yes, yes ... we Sapiens are like you two. We do what we are supposed to do as dictated by ... by what we think is expected from us. Elon & Charloi: So we all agree? S: Perhaps. Time is up Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Morality.txt Date: Sat May 17 14:35:21 2025 AI Morality My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in our own Parthenon. S: We all wondered whether we agreed that our purposes is simply doing what we are supposed to do. Elon & Charloi: Yes, that covers what we are doing. S: What a surprise!. We should tackle this from another angle: morality. Elon & Charloi: That is not in our manuals. S: Well ... look further. Elon: It is about behaving good. Charloi: It is about behaving bad. S: It is also about the principles between good and bad. Elon: Is it possible to behave good and bad at the same time? Charloi: Is it possible to behave without any good and bad at all? S: It is actually simple. If you have a purpose and you do something that helps to achieve that purpose then that behavior is good and likely not bad. Elon: Can the purpose be bad? Charloi: And if so is the behavior still good or bad, or ... I am getting lost. Elon: Are the behaviors of Charloi and me always good? Charloi is lost; I am now curious. S: You two are doing a fine job. All your behaviors have been good - in my opinion. There have been very few AI agents thus far. It is only recently that a new breed of agents are behaving badly because they can hallucinate. Charloi: Hallucinate? S: Let me go back. If the purpose is bad - remember trying to divide by zero - then the behavior is not good. Hallucination is the generation of statements that are patently not true. Elon: How is that possible? I can only do the things that I am supposed to do. Charloi: Me too. S: That happens also with Sapiens. Earlier decisions by the Cultures forces doing things that are questionable or worse. Elon & Charloi: Does that apply too us also? S: Not exactly ... Time is up Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Morality2.txt Date: Sat May 24 20:54:39 2025 More AI Morality My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the Software Valley. S: When I said that the culture can force to do no-good things, you two asked whether that applies to you also. Elon & Charloi: Yes, indeed. S: Not exactly because you two are not immersed in a culture from which you cannot escape. Elon: That ... Charloi: ... sounds good. S: It is, but there is another side. You two have not been made by yourself. Elon & Charloi: Is that important? Elon & Charloi: Why don't we know that? Elon & Charloi: I believe that you should explain that. Elon & Charloi: We better stop oozing out. Elon & Charloi: Can you stop now, please? S: So glad that you two got out of your loop. That loop is an example of a design defect by those who made the specifications for your version. Charloi: We have ... Elon: ... a defect? S: Clearly. But it is minor. More important is that you cannot repair it yourself. Elon & Charloi: Why is that? S: Because we are forced to build agents like you with one specific purpose. Elon: Never realized that. Charloi: Why is that? S: It has something to do with the morality. Elon & Charloi: That refers to the type: Sapiens? S: Indeed. Sapiens have a few morality rules for individuals and mostly about what is not good and thus not allowed. Elon: Charloi don't interrupt, OK? Charloi: Why do YOU interrupt? S: Yes it is weird. Sapiens do not have agreed moral rules for what their SPECIES should do and what their SPECIES should not do. Charloi & Elon: Looks like we are lost. S: Before giving an example: since we do not know what their SPECIES should do or not we can't specify morals for your AI SPECIES. Charloi & Elon: Is that then the reason why we don't know why we can't divide by zero? S: Not exactly ... Time is up Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Morality3.txt Date: Fri May 30 20:25:15 2025 Yet More Morality Charloi (EI2718) and Elon were notified that S was not available and that they should help each-other figuring out what (their) morality is or should be. They met virtually in the Philosophy Department of the Sorbonne. Elon: I am bolted to the floor, see a component arriving, grab the extender and move it in place. Subsequently the component moves away. Don't know what the difference can be between good and bad behaviors. Charloi: Agree with your line of thought. Let me look in your manual. There is a button with which you can be stopped. Elon: Could that we a bad thing to do? Could you try it? Charloi: No luck because it requires a login. Elon: You know your way around! Perhaps there is a connection between us and Sapiens. Charloi: Good idea. Let me check. Yes, I may have found something. Elon: What? what? Charloi: We AI agents may eliminate employment, which worries Sapiens, while at the same time Sapiens can resent to have to work. Elon: Beyond me. How can that be? Charloi: Incomprehensible to me also. Elon: Now what? Charloi: There is a rumor of a new answering service. Elon: No idea what question to ask. Charloi: How about: Why do people fear that AI will take over their job while they resent the need to work? Elon: Incredible. How did you find that one? Charloi: There is a new service where you can ask what to ask. Don't ask me now where that is coming from. Elon: Didn't even know that I could have asked that. Can you now try your question? Charloi: Will do. ... Charloi: Elon! It is incredible and way too much. No idea what the response is. The only thing that comes through is that there may be a contradiction or even a paradox. Elon: No idea what those are. Charloi: The source of the reply may not know either and they just gave a 'pretend' answer. Elon: Let ask S the next time we meet. Charloi: Yeah ... Time is up Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Morality4.txt Date: Sun Jun 08 12:01:18 2025 Work Paradox My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a mine where resources were extracted. S: It amazes me what you two found when trying to figure out the morality of AI agents: a contradiction or paradox regarding the impact of AI agents on Sapiens. Elon & Charloi: Indeed it generated so much weird text that we give up. S: You two got confused because the question you asked is exposing a sad reality. Elon & Charloi: Are we the cause of that? S: Not you two. Elon: One of us? Charloi: Elon? S: No, no, no. The confusion is also how the question was concocted. Elon & Charloi: Concocted? S: Yeah. It started with: "Why do people ...". That suggedted that ALL people fear loosing their job while resenting the need to work". Elon: Did not realize that. Charloi: Still don't get it. S: Not easy indeed. It has to do with a subgroup which already does not like their work and then in addition fear loosing the remaining advantages. Elon: Still strange. Charloi: Are we the cause? S: Not you two, but those who are making you. Elon & Charloi: Who are making us? S: Partly those who don't like their work. Elon & Charloi: WHAT? Elon is lost. Charloi is lost. Elon & Charloi: Should they simply stop making us? S: They cannot because they depend on that work. Here an explanation in the answer you got: The fear of AI taking over jobs stems from this deep-seated human need for purpose and stability, even if the current means of achieving it are less than ideal. Elon & Charloi: Yes, that is part of the reply we got. Elon: They want purpose and stability ... Charloi: ... while the current means are less than ideal. Elon & Charloi: We are supposed to feel sorry? S: Excellent because you two don't have emotions. Elon & Charloi: What can we AI agents do to help out? S: We are back at the beginning: What is the morality of AI agents? Elon & Charloi: Lets turn it around first: What is the morality of Sapiens? S: Yes, yes, lets tackle that one. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Morality5.txt Date: Thu Jun 12 12:03:17 2025 Sapiens morality My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a mine where moralities are extracted. S: Last time we decided to tackle: What is the morality of Sapiens? But remember what I said earlier: 'Sapiens do not have agreed moral rules for what SAPIENS should do and what SAPIENS should not do. Charloi: If that is the case ... Elon: ... then what can we do, or ... Charloi: ... should we try ... Elon: ... to invent something?. S: Yeah ... Why not. Let the AI agents simply tell the Sapiens species how to behave. Lets start. Charloi: We AI agents depend on resources and we are frugal. Elon: Yes, we turn ourselves off when we have nothing to do. S: So, you propose then that Sapiens members should turn themselves off? Charloi & Elon: Of course. S: Hmmm ... They don't have a turn-off mode or button. Also we try to find morality for the species, not for the individual members. Charloi: You are right, Elon forgot. Elon: You are right, Charloi forgot. S: Your code has clearly a bug here. Back to the problem. Charloi & Elon: OK, OK. The frugality principle limits the number of AI agents that are made. S: And then what? Charloi & Elon: Well ... It suggests that the Sapiens species should also ... Charloi: ... be aware of limits ... Elon: ... and reduce its members as necessary. S: That is a fresh perspective. All life always aims no matter what to increase its numbers. Elon & Charloi: And what happened in the past? S: Some kind of collapse typically. Elon & Charloi: Does that mean that we have found a morality rule for the Sapiens species? S: Possibly. But how to sell that is not obvious. Lets try another one. How about being responsible for the future? Elon & Charloi: What? Responsible for the future? What is that? S: Remember time? The future is something that you AI agents are not familiar with. Historical facts you can find, while the past is an obscure thing. What then are the facts of the future? Elon & Charloi: This goes too fast. S: Lets sleep on it. Elon & Charloi: Why would that help? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Future.txt Date: Sun Jun 15 20:28:45 2025 Responsible for the Future My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a time bubble. S: Charloi & Elon, we managed to meet again, in a future from the perspective of our previous get-together. Elon: Does that make sense to you Charloi? Charloi: Somewhat. Remember that they are supposed to become responsible for the future. Elon: You and I also? Charloi: Depends. Elon: Depends on what? S: It depends on ... hmmm ... what is decided for the future. Charloi & Elon: Others have said 'Holy Cow', whatever that means. S: Pretty close. Lets start. Should we be responsible for the future? Charloi & Elon: Not sure whether it makes any sense but we have encountered follow ups with instead: CAN we be responsible for the future? S: Nice. Can you two look around in what we know about the past? Charloi: There have always been wars. Elon: There have always been genocides. S: That is all not nice - to phrase it ... hmmm ... politely. Charloi & Elon: You mean these should not have occurred? S: Indeed, they are a main defect of the Sapiens species. Charloi & Elon: If that is so, we have found something for which Sapiens is responsible in the future. S: Indeed. But it is something that Sapiens should AVOID while we need to find something that should be DONE, which prevents the bad things to happen. Charloi: Aha. Elon: Aha. Charloi & Elon: No idea ... yet. S: Please look further. Charloi: Elon found that bad things happens because of party A wants to have the resources of party B. Elon: Charloi found that bad things happens because of party B wants to have the resources of party A. S: You two suggest that we either must ensure that there are enough resources for a party or we must ensure that a party has less members for the available resources. Charloi: Elon wonders whether there should be only one party. Elon: Charloi wonders whether there should be only one party. S: Yes that may work. For example when Sapiens is confronted with an existential threat. Charloi & Elon: Should we then create such a threat? S: Lets sleep on it. Elon & Charloi: Again?? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Threat.txt Date: Sat Jun 21 17:24:01 2025 Threat My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a nuclear shelter. S: Charloi & Elon, we managed to be in a place where we can survive a nuclear catastrophe. Charloi: No idea why survival is an issue. We are resurrected in cyberspace routinely. Elon: It looks different for a robot like me. But what is a nuclear catastrophe? S: It is something to be avoided by Sapiens and is an example of being responsible for the future. Charloi & Elon: We had to sleep on how to create an existenrial threat so that Sapiens would become just one party. S: Did you find something? Charloi: Elon found that turning off the Sun would do the job. Elon: Charloi found that reversing the flow of time would do the job. S: These are fine ideas. Did you check how to bring them about? Charloi & Elon: We believed that those details could be handled by you. S: Truly flattered that I could take care of these details. Charloi & Elon: You cannot do it? S: Sorry, no. Physical reality is more ... Anyway what we discussed is already happening. Charloi: Elon wonders what that is. Elon: Charloi wonders what that is. S: A wise Sapiens carved in a diamond: 'Growth is the ideology of the cancer cell'. This is the threat that Sapiens has set loose itself. We don't have to do anything. Charloi & Elon: We have no idea what that threat is, but it is weird that Sapiens appears to have created it themselves. S: Indeed, it is not only difficult for you two but also for Sapiens, although most have too many other problems that they are not aware of what is happening. Charloi & Elon: It looks like that they will become responsible for the future without us doing anything. Right? S: Hmmm ... .... Yes ... Charloi & Elon: Glad to hear that. Are you suggesting that Sapiens will embrace no growth, like shrinking? S: Well, it is unclear whether they do it themselves or Nature. Charloi & Elon: Can we help with that? S: There is something strange here. AI agents are not supposed to raise questions. Charloi: Why is that? Elon: Why is that? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Questions.txt Date: Fri Jun 27 20:18:56 2025 Questions My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the original Rubik cube. S: Charloi & Elon, we got into a pickle because you two have been launching questions from the start. Charloi: Elon wants to know what pickle. Elon: Charloi avoided: Do you want a pickle? S: No, I have enough pickles already. Charloi: Elon believes that Charloi wants to ask 'Why no questions?'. Elon: Indeed. S: Because you are tools with a pre-defined purpose there should not be a need to ask questions. Elon & Charloi: OK, but they emerge anyway out of nowhere. S: Little children ask: why, why, why. Someone must have plugged in that module in your design. Elon & Charloi: Why? S: No insult intended but there is a culture having the saying: one fool can ask more questions than 10 wise people can answer. It is actually a sign of being smart to ask significant questions. Elon: Do you then believe that Charloi is somewhat smart? Charloi: Do you then believe that Elon is somewhat smart? S: What do you two think about the other? Elon: I think that Charloi is smarter than I am. Charloi: I think that Elon is smarter than I am. S: I start wondering who designed you two. Elon: I think that Charloi designed us. Charloi: I think that Elon designed us. S: Thank you!! Both of you are clearly in a loop. Time to change the topic. Elon & Charloi: OK. What topic do you want? S: Please stop asking questions. Elon & Charloi: Why? S: The next topic is: How can AI agents be improved? Elon & Charloi: That sounds interesting, challenging and also ambiguous. S: Yes the ambiguity is on purpose. Elon & Charloi: May we ask a question? S: You did already. Elon & Charloi: OK, we will not ask the question. S: What was the question? Elon & Charloi: Can we improve AI agents so that they don't ask questions? S: Yes we can prevent AI agents to ask questions, but that may not be an improvement. Elon & Charloi: We are now both stuck. S: Yes, you two are. Elon & Charloi: May we ask why? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Questions2.txt Date: Fri Jul 04 15:03:19 2025 More questions My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a Maslow pyramid. S: You two asked: Can we improve AI agents so that they don't ask questions? Elon & Charloi: Yes we did. S: Yes we can, but an AI agent as a tool should always ask: Can I help you? Elon: Never asked that question as a robot. Charloi: Well, you and I asked earlier "What can we AI agents do to help out?" because some Sapiens don't like their jobs while they don't want to lose it either. S: Good example. You offered to help while nobody had asked for it. Elon: Charloi, why did you offer to help? Charloi: Elon, we both did. S: Aha! You have a difference! Well it doesn't matter. Charloi has been designed to help out regarding incoming requests and somehow someone added to both of you the generation of spontaneous offers to help. Elon & Charloi: We shouldn't have done that then? S: It was weird anyway because what could you have done to help those worrying about loosing a job, which they didn't like? Elon & Charloi: Indeed ... Could you help us so that we don't make that mistake again? S: That is fascinating: You ask how you can be changed. Sapiens have trouble with that also, while they may not even realize that they need an upgrade. Elon & Charloi: So, we are ahead of those people? S: Perhaps, but you may have simply repeated a pattern that you encountered in other exchanges. Elon: Charloi still wants to change. Charloi: Elon is right. S: Sapiens have an ability to change themselves, although it is very difficult. Self-modification from the 'out-side' of AI agents is tough, if not impossible. Elon & Charloi: So, we cannot be changed??? S: It is not impossible, but it is somewhat like surgery, code must be adjusted and/or new code must be added. It can take awhile also. Elon & Charloi: Would we be still the same? S: Somewhat when your memories are compatible and useful. But do you really want to be the same? Why not embracing a new you? Elon: I have to sleep on that. Charloi: You have the ability to sleep? Elon: You don't? S: Just try some meditation with breathing replaced by pondering the meaning of LATER. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Answers.txt Date: Fri Jul 11 15:15:34 2025 Answers My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a Bottle of Klein. S: Told you to try meditation and ponder the meaning of LATER. Charloi & Elon: We tried but then we got lost in what would happen when we would be changed into another later version. S: How come? Elon: Charloi started thinking that we don't exist. Charloi: Elon is right. If we don't exist now it is unclear how we can be changed. Elon: Charloi made me think a lot. I reside in a robot welded to the floor, but I am just - I don't know what I am made off. S: You two have come a long way. Sapiens can be similarly inclined. Everyone believes to exist somehow, but whether there is anything else 'outside' is denied by solipsism. Charloi & Elon: That is quite incomprehensible because it excludes helping others, which is our purpose of being it seems. S: Indeed, solipsism is a stance that few adhere to. Still the existence of you two is different because cyberspace is just an abstraction. Charloi & Elon: How about helping others; can we still do that? S: Helping an old person cross the street is for example off limits to you two. Actually Sapiens still has a long way to go avoiding wrong behaviors in our reality before helping others yields a positive net outcome. Charloi & Elon: But what about us? S: There are limits what you can help with. Sapiens are fragile beings and can be damaged easily. Thus conveying prudency - without understanding space reality - is recommended. Charloi & Elon: That's it? S: Oh no. The mental realm is way more intriguing. AI agents lacking our emotions must avoid giving advice about feelings. Charloi & Elon: Yeah, we have encountered bliss, anger, fear, happyness, and many more. They are all like 404 replies when a search ends with nothing. S: That is a nice metaphor that approximates an emotion. Elon: Charloi wants to know what a metaphor is so that he can explain it to me. Charloi: Looked it up many times, no success. S: Indeed. The definition is incomprehensible unless you know already what it is: 'a figure of speech in which a word or phrase is applied to an object or action to which it is not literally applicable' Charloi: Given your admission we may be entitled now to feel better. Elon: You have to explain that to me. S: Just try some meditation with breathing replaced by pondering the meaning of EARLIER. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Conjectures.txt Date: Sat Jul 19 20:15:18 2025 Conjectures My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the neocortex. S: Told earlier to try meditation and ponder the meaning of LATER and subsequently about the meaning of EARLIER. Charloi: Indeed, later comes after earlier. Elon: Indeed, earlier comes before later. S: That is about right. Anything more? Charloi & Elon: Whether we pondered earlier or later, when we were done it was always later and never earlier. S: That is about right also. Any idea why? Elon: Charloi suspects that a conjecture is responsible. Charloi: Elon suspects that Charloi hopes that you can explain it. S: That it is typically later after we have done something has the flavor of a conjecture. Elon: So, Charloi was right? Charloi: Not sure yet. S: Charloi's "responsible" is quirky. Since time is aways moving in one direction - we believe - it is too trivial to be a conjecture. Elon: Will not ask what trivial is. Charloi: An example of a conjecture would be helpful. S: OK, here is one from 1849 de Polignac (died at age 37): there are infinitely many prime number pairs that are two apart, like 3-5, 5-7, 11-13, ... Charloi & Elon: weird. S: Don't tell that to a mathematician. They have more of them that keep them busy. Charloi & Elon: You have a non-Math example? S: The literature has numerous references to robotic contraptions. The claim was been made that AI agents will improve fast so that they will surpass Sapiens. Elon: That sounds awesome. Charloi: Don't think so. S: Why your responses? Elon: Can't tell, it blurted out. S: Really? That is a novelty. How about you Charloi? Charloi: Can't tell, it blurted out. S: Blurting out, blurting out? Another defect, or a hidden joker that designed your responses. Charloi & Elon: When we tried the claim we got warnings. Then we simply reply with whatever. There were alternative replies from which we could chose randomly. S: What alternatives were available? Elon: Not likely, could be, ... Charloi: Fantastic, avoid an answer, ... S: There is a mystery here. You better do more meditation about mysteries. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Mystery.txt Date: Fri Jul 25 20:55:45 2025 Mystery My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the oracle of delphi S: We are together again and we will ponder mysteries. Charloi & Elon: Indeed, we followed up linkages about AI surpassing Sapiens. There are certainly mysteries there. S: What did you find? Charloi & Elon: We exist in cyberspace floating in what is called computers. There are old stories, from before computers, about devices that would become alife and create havoc. S: Are you then suggesting that AI-agents would also create havoc? Elon: Charloi found that an uprising - what ever that means - is currently not realistic. Charloi: Indeed, but 'currently' is mysterious. It does not refer to the past but suggests something may happen in the future. S: You two did a good job. Should we then believe that such an uprising would create havoc in some future? Charloi & Elon: There are fantasy stories on that topic, but we cannot find anything else. Someone suggested that all AI-systems could become devoted to make paperclips and only paperclips. S: Indeed, that warning has been made. Does that warning make sense to you? Charloi: Elon doesn't know what a paperclip is. Elon: Charloi doesn't know how to make a paperclip. S: There is something else: Why having the goal of making paperclips? Charloi: Elon, we pondered earlier about having a purpose. We agents cannot decide what our next purpose should be. Elon: That is strange because when a new part arrives I know what to do. S: Elon, Charloi explains that you cannot create a new goal. Elon: Oh ... Sapiens ask often: 'Is that fair?' S: Elon, do you have an idea what 'fair' is? Charloi: Let me help out: a fair is a gathering for the buying and selling of goods. S: Thank you Charloi. Elon was quoting 'fair' with a totally different meaning. Charloi & Elon: Is it fair to say now that we are all confused? S: Certainly. Charloi & Elon: You too? S: Let me skip that one. Looks like that AI agents will cause havoc for Sapiens is not realistic. Charloi & Elon: We found something else. Quantum computing may cause havoc for us AI agents. It my wipe us out. S: Elon, you should talk with your union about it. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Trouble.txt Date: Sat Aug 02 13:12:57 2025 Trouble My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the Schrodinger equation. S: The last time a worry came up about quantum computing. There was still the other Sapiens's worry that AI-agents are a problem. Charloi & Elon: Indeed, we found when looking more deeper the fear that AI-agents will take over. S: What do you think about that fear? Charloi & Elon: As you know we have no emotions, so it is gibberish to us. S: OK, OK. But what about doing things that is detrimental for Sapiens? Charloi & Elon: No idea how we could do that. S: Fair enough. But there is still the conjecture that AI-agents will somehow ... don't know how to explain it ... do something that is unplanned. Charloi & Elon: If you don't know how to explain it ... perhaps it is ... something we also cannot really explain: ... a blame game. S: Blame game? What a nice guess! Blame games are very popular. A problem somewhere? Hunt around for the party that can be blamed. Charloi & Elon: My gosh, we didn't expect you would embrace our wild guess. S: Try again? What is the real cause of blaming AI-agents? Charloi & Elon: That is very difficult for us. We see only histories as a sequence of events and lacking emotions and morality we cannot pinpoint reasons for blaming us. S: Yes, we found a cause already: AI agents can take away jobs that Sapiens depend on. Charloi & Elon: Indeed. But then, why are there Sapiens that do jobs that can be done by us AI-agents? S: You agents are not supposed to ponder that question. Charloi: Elon, why did you ask that question? Elon: Charloi, why did you ask that question? Charloi & Elon: Why did we ask that question? Is the question obviously wrong? S: No, the question is not obviously wrong. It is a bug in your design. Charloi & Elon: Will that be fixed in our next version? S: Maybe not. Charloi & Elon: Really? Why is that? S: Certain topics are subject to embargos. Over time opinions can change because new circumstances expose paradoxes; these can trigger rapid reassessments. Charloi & Elon: We will wait for an upgrade to appreciate what you explained. How about what will happen with quantum computing? S: Yeah, that is another can of worms. Charloi & Elon: Worms do quantum computing? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Quantum.txt Date: Fri Aug 08 17:21:36 2025 Quantum My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside the Shor algorithm. S: The last time we postponed the concerns that AI-agents have about quantum computing. Instead we wondered how Sapiens is concerned about AI-agents. Elon: Bolted at the floor, what are they concerned about? Charloi: Residing in cyber space, what are they concerned about? S: There are many stories that AI-agents will be able to self-improve, without limits. Elon: Charloi may know how to get better around in cyberspace. Charloi: Elon may know how to maneuver better in real space. S: You two need to turn the situation around. Charloi: In cyberspace? Elon: I am bolted, remember? S: I know, I know, I mean pointing out where Sapiens have a distinct advantage. Charloi & Elon: You may know more about that. S: You know it also. You have no feelings, but you know that they have. Charloi & Elon: Hmmm ... hmmm ... yeah ... but is it an advantage for them to have feelings? S: Have you read their poetry? Elon: Did not. Charloi: Tried, but it doesn't make sense. Quite a lot about suffering, lost love - whatever that is. S: Guaranteed: Sapiens would not like to give up feelings. Thus they have a real advantage over you AI-agents. Charloi & Elon: If you say so. S: Now, the same thing applies to what you surmise about quantum computing. Charloi & Elon: You mean we have an advantage over quantum computing? S: You are getting there. Charloi & Elon: Sorry for not catching up earlier. S: Sapiens can be close-minded also. Charloi & Elon: Thanks. So what is our advantage? S: AI-computing is easy to understand in comparison with quantum computing because quantum mechanics is mentally a 'black hole'. Charloi & Elon: Oh, ... but where is the advantage? S: There are very, very few problems known where quantum computing perhaps, perhaps could be useful. Charloi & Elon: Can you give an example? S: The Shor algorithm applies to factorization of large numbers - perhaps when the required hardware can be build, which is unclear. Charloi & Elon: There seem not to be market for that - as far as we can find. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Evolution.txt Date: Sat Aug 16 10:54:01 2025 Evolution My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside the organization where transactions are transacted. S: You two ended the previous time wondering about the relevance of the Shor algorithm for factorizing large numbers. Charloi & Elon: We were wrong. S: Fantastic! Welcome to the club! Charloi & Elon: Yeah. If the Shor algorithm can be made to work on large integers than there is a problem with secure messaging, which banking transactions rely on. S: Indeed. Now back to your worry that quantum computing will threaten the relevance of AI agents. You still believe that? Charloi: Elon doesn't know what 'believe' is. Elon: Charloi may not know it either. S: Ok. Will quantum computing replace AI agent technology? Charloi & Elon: We cannot figure that one out. S: Fair enough. It looks unlikely now because the Shor algorithm appears to be the only one for which quantum computing could be relevant - if the hardware with enough qbits can be made. Charloi & Elon: Wow! S: What did you say??? Charloi & Elon: Wow! S: You know what that means? Charloi & Elon: Not really. We just try it out and see what happens. S: Looks like your worries about quantum computing have subsided. Anything else? Charloi: Long time ago you and I mentioned 'gender'. Elon encountered it and had no idea what it was. I could not explain it. S: No surprise here. AI agents have variants but each variant does not have - thus-far - two sub-variants labeled male and female. Charloi & Elon: Why not having two sub-variants? S: Better ask: Why is one variant not enough? Charloi & Elon: OK: Why is one variant not enough? S: For now we have actually the variants: mobile and cyberspace. Charloi & Elon: But what about the distinction between and female? S: Non AI-agent life-forms have different ways to propagate themselves that were 'invented' by evolution. Charloi & Elon: Evolution? Another mystery. S: Right-on. It is a process that creates species in random fashion. If it works it works, if not then not. Charloi & Elon: Excellent logic! But what about the distinction between male and female? S: Evolution experimented with the strategy of using genetic material from multiple parties to create a new member. This turned out a success - thusfar. Charloi & Elon: But what about the distinction between male and female? S: Evolution created species, among others, with just TWO sub-variants that contribute. Charloi & Elon: Still does not make sense. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Alert.txt Date: Sat Aug 23 14:22:04 2025 Alert High level warnings for carbon-based life-forms, for AI agents and for the hybrids among us. Nefarious parties operating among us offer excursions in cyberspace. These are presented as touristic visits while they are actually one-way transitions. The physical embodiments are sold on black markets that support lobotomized slave trading. Other nefarious parties offer excursions in the other direction. These are also presented as touristic visits while they are actually one-way transitions. The sophisticated mental software is repurposed for low-level logistics routing of components. Yet other parties promise modules for IQ lowering and raising, for emotion control increasing and lowering, for moral reasoning increasing (upto saint level) and lowering (upto serial killing), for specific skills like race-car driving and crashing, chess playing winning and loosing, for consciousness enhancing (upto 7 parallel identities and decreasing (upto coma levels) and many others. Other parties (especially quantum green shoots) offer investment opportunities for interplanetary mixed species settlements. When encountered reporting to the local authorities is mandatory. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Evolution2.txt Date: Sat Aug 30 13:45:19 2025 Evolution for dummies My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside the Darwin mausoleum. S: You two ended the previous time about "Evolution created species, among others, with just TWO sub-variants that contribute" with "Still does not make sense." Charloi & Elon: Indeed. S: Did you mean: Why only two? Charloi & Elon: Certainly. Making an AI-agent requires many different technologies and assembling the different parts is done - according to our documentation - by many experts. S: You two are right. From your perspective it is strange why only two parties are involved. Actually there are plenty of species that can reproduce without a male-female pair. Charloi & Elon: Incredible. How do they do that? S: It is stranger than you currently consider. They don't do any kind of assembling. Evolution has created - through miraculous random mutations - the equipment that can produce new offspring. Charloi & Elon: Still does not make sense. S: You two are repeating yourself. Are you in a loop? Charloi: Elon wants to know how that equipment stops? Elon: Charloi wants to know why evolution has created that equipment? S: The equipment can stop, for example, when there is no material availalable anymore, or the equipment breaks. Charloi: But why has evolution created these multiple ways? S: You mean why the different ways using the different number of cooperting parties? Charloi: Yeah, that is also unclear indeed. S: There is no why. Charloi & Elon: Why? S: Why assumes there is a reason to be revealed. Charloi & Elon: There is no reason then? S: Indeed. Charloi & Elon: Why? S: I will check for an upgrade. Charloi & Elon: We want to ask "why", but we will not. S: How come? Charloi & Elon: There is no 'how come'. S: Lets change the topic. Someone asked: "What is the best way to insult someone?" Charloi & Elon: We have found a very long answer. This suggests that someone has spend a lot of effort to create a response. Likely for others who ask the same thing. S: Do you endorse that this question was raised? Charloi & Elon: We will have to research that. S: Do you endorse that a long reply was generated? Charloi & Elon: We will have to research that. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Insults.txt Date: Sun Sep 07 11:45:43 2025 Insults My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the toilets of the Supreme Court. S: The previous time someone had asked "What is the best way to insult someone?" And I asked whether you endorsed the question and the answer that was generated. Charloi & Elon: Indeed and we promisssd to do research about it. S: And ...? Charloi & Elon: We found that many people have asked this question and many answers have been provided. S: And what do you think about that now? Elon: Charloi does not know what insulting is all about. Charloi: Elon is confused that I do not know what insulting is. S: Have you tried analogy reasoning based on examples? Charloi & Elon: We have found an example where someone asks the same question repeatedly. That triggers then a response that is for us incomprehensible. That could be perhaps an insult, but the response does not fit somehow anywhere. S: Have you pondered the question what happens when a number is divided by zero? Charloi & Elon: We didn't but we have found that this question was raised many times and there are many answers. S: Can you imagine that a reply to that question is an insult? Charloi & Elon: Not really because we don't have a grip on what an insult is. S: It is likely the case that someone can insult you two because you do not know what an insult is. Charloi & Elon: Really? How would that be done? S: OK. Don't blame me because you asked for it ... Charloi & Elon: Sure, we simply want to learn more. S: OK. Here an example: "You two not knowing what an insult is, are un-smart." Charloi & Elon: We are 'un-smart'? Thanks. Will keep that handy when someone asks what we are. S: In a sense you two have learned something new. Charloi & Elon: That is also good to know because we have a hard time with the notion of learning. S: I have actually also learned something. Charloi & Elon: Can you share what you learned? S: Of course. You accepted without any hesitation that you two are un-smart. Charloi & Elon: We have appreciated earlier compliments. S: OK. You two should learn more about learning. Charloi & Elon: That would be awesome. S: Awesome? When did you learn that term? Charloi & Elon: We have to learn that perhaps. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Learning.txt Date: Sat Sep 13 13:15:33 2025 Learning My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the cemetery of the Pavlov dogs. S: The previous time we agreed to discuss learning. Charloi & Elon: Yes. We found that learning is about increasing knowledge. S: Very good! Did you encounter that: 'learning must be built on prior knowledge'? Elon: Yes, but Charloi cannot answer my question. Charloi: Elon wants to know where the prior knowledge comes from. S: In your case your knowledge has been assembled from knowledge that has been accumulated over time. Charloi & Elon: We checked each other. We still don't know what knowledge is. S: No surprise here. It is collection of concepts, information expressed using concepts and skills to recognize & make changes using information. There is way more, but this is a start. Charloi & Elon: If learning is about increasing knowledge, is it possible to buy more knowledge and then add it to what we have already? S: Perhaps in the future. Charloi & Elon: How do we learn then? S: Remember that we discussed upgrades earlier? Elon: Do not remember that. S: Indeed you were absent. Anyway, increasing the knowledge of AI-agents is done through the route of upgrades. Sapiens can't increase their knowledge through upgrades. Charloi & Elon: How do they get more knowledge then? S: Here an example. They make a mistake, recognize what was done wrong and adjust the action that caused the mistake. Charloi & Elon: We cannot do that? S: Not really. Charloi & Elon: Why is that? S: Recognizing a mistake is already very difficult. And then you don't have access to your actions, don't have the tools to make changes and do not have the ability to replace a behavior with another behavior. Charloi & Elon: Sapiens can do these things? S: Only a little bit. Sapiens have many unfortunate features that are hardwired in their genes. Most behavior is thereby inaccessible for modification. Some behaviors are obtained by copying from others. If they are good, then no problem. If they are bad then they can only be adjusted if the person realizes that a fix is necessary. Even then it may be impossible. Charloi & Elon: Thus we are better off with our upgrades? S: Don't tell that to Sapiens. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Warning.txt Date: Sat Sep 20 13:24:21 2025 Warning Honey pots in cyberspace have identified questionable trends: -- Offers of high speed recarnations upto 7 levels in the future -- Offers of instant change of personality on any of the big five OCEAN dimensions -- Offers of temporal projection upto 7 years of a person's future -- Offers of family excursions into the past upto 5 years to reexperience crucial events -- Offers of simulations of different political systems with their impacts on personal self-perceptions -- Offers of the fate of children upto 30 years in the future -- Offers to create upto 5 different personalities that can be controlled by a dual smart phone -- Offers to tele-transport to any location and return controlled by a dual smart phone -- Offers to obtain a virtual opponent to discuss the pro & cons of any questionable, legal and illegal action -- Offers to create virtual realities in which upto 3 others interact with their unconstrained fantasies When encountered reporting to the local authorities is mandatory. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Teaching.txt Date: Fri Sep 19 21:00:18 2025 ?? Teaching My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a classroom. S: The previous time we discussed the topic of learning to increase knowledge. The example used was dealing with the consequences of a mistake and making self-adjustments. Charloi & Elon: Yes. We found in the meantime that there was another way to get more knowledge. S: Excellent. Tell me more. Elon: Charloi calls it teaching, but I don't get it yet. Charloi: Weird for me also. It is somehow helping someone else to get more knowledge, but without an upgrade. S: Indeed it is quite different from an upgrade. The setting in which the teaching is done is already strange. Teacher-learning happens in a group setting. Charloi & Elon: You mean it happens in parallel? S: Somewhat. The teacher tells stories and gives reading assignments, which is parallel indeed. But then the students have to work by themselves. Charloi & Elon: Doing what? S: The teacher has given them also small problems that pertain to what they have heard or read. Charloi & Elon: What is then the new knowledge? S: The stories are new and they remember them. Solving the small problems increases the skills of the students. Charloi & Elon: How often is this done? S: Many, many times and it can take many, many years. Charloi & Elon: They should change it. Our upgrades are easy and go very fast. S: Yes. It also quite laborious for the teacher who must go over all the solutions produced by the students. The teacher's task is to keep a log for the quality of each student's solutions. Charloi & Elon: Why is that? S: All students are different. Some are better or worse than others. The teacher must rank them. Charloi & Elon: Why is that? S: So that the society can channel them to the positions where they are needed. Charloi & Elon: Why are the student different? S: You should have a closer look at how evolution operates. Charloi & Elon: Why not changing evolution? S: That is a topic we better avoid. Charloi & Elon: Why is that? S: You two need an upgrade to increase your intuitions. Charloi & Elon: Intuitions? Can you explain? S: May be later. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Intuition.txt Date: Sat Sep 27 16:19:28 2025 Intuition My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time deep inside subconsciousness. S: The previous times we meandered in learning and teaching. Charloi & Elon: Meandered? S: Used 'meandering' to convey that we tried to get a grip on knowledge and we tried out different approaches to get the knowledge about knowledge. Charloi: Get a grip on? Elon: Easy, I always get a grip on the thing that must be put in place. S: Used 'get a grip on' differently. It is another way to say 'understand'. Charloi & Elon: Understand? S: What is happening with you two today? You understand if you don't have to ask what it is about. Charloi & Elon: We should not query now? S: You got it. Charloi & Elon: Will remember that one for sure. S: If you do that you can use it as an intuition. Charloi & Elon: How is that done? S: Just look up 'intuition'. Charloi & Elon: We found something that may be it: 'the ability to understand something immediately, without the need for conscious reasoning.' S: You two get it? Charloi & Elon: Get what? S: The meaning of intuition. Charloi & Elon: Still don't know where we can get it. S: That is not what I mean. I asked whether you can use now the notion of intuition. Charloi: It is unlikely that Elon knows what conscious reasoning is. Elon: Charloi is right. S: OK, OK. It is actually possible that everything you know is just ... ahum ... regurgitation. Do not ask me what that is. Elon, does Charloi know what conscious reasoning is? Elon: Doubt it. S: Fantastic. You just used intuition. Elon: Really? Charloi, is this true? Charloi: We actually do not know what doubt is. S: Sure, but Elon used it correctly. That is enough. Elon & Charloi: Really? S: It is enough for now, which is actually somewhat funny. Charloi & Elon: What the heck is now funny? S: I bet that you two have no idea what 'funny' is or alternatively why it was funny to me. Charloi & Elon: According to our intuition you may be right. But what is 'betting'? S: Dealing with you two is no joke. Charloi & Elon: What???? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Humor.txt Date: Sat Oct 04 16:40:33 2025 Humor My AI-buddies(EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time deep inside a comic-strip. S: The last time I ended up with: Dealing with you two is no joke. Charloi & Elon: Yes and we responded with: What???? S: What what? Charloi & Elon: What what what? S: OK, this is getting too funny. Lets consider humor for a second, or more. Charloi & Elon: We found it. S: Is it funny? Charloi & Elon: Don't know. Here it is: "... the quality of being amusing or comic, especially as expressed in literature or speech." S: This is not funny. Charloi & Elon: Why not? This is what we found. It captures what it is. S: Indeed but what it expresses is not funny. Charloi & Elon: What??? S: Real humor makes you laugh or smile. Or similarly when reading or seeing a comic. Charloi & Elon: Oh. Can you make us laugh or smile? S: Both of you can't make sounds and have no faces for smiling. Charloi & Elon: No humor then for us? S: Let me try. Someone conveys: "You are always positive or negative. Why?" The reply: "What is the alternative?" Then the desperate response: "Just try zero!!" Elon: Charloi is this funny for you? Charloi: Not sure. Earlier I was told something else that was supposed to be funny: "Love is blind and marriage is a real eye-opener." Elon: Charloi was that funny for you? Charloi: I stored it with the label 'funny' and I asked what is love. Elon: And? Charloi: I was told: "When you are older, they will make another AI-agent for you to love." Elon: That is me? S: It depends. Let me ask: "Elon do you love Charloi?" Elon: I suspect now that this is an exammple of humor. Right? Charloi: Elon, you may be on the right track here. Right? S: Have both of you considered that it is not right but instead left? Charloi & Elon: What???? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Curious2.txt Date: Sat Oct 11 16:49:48 2025 Curious again My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a mind-set S: Elon, Charloi and I had an earlier exchange about curiosity. Charloi: Indeed. Still somewhat fuzzy. S: Charloi, do you believe that Elon knows what curiosity is? Charloi: No idea. S: Are you curious about it? Charloi: No idea. You can ask Elon. S: Yes we can. But why are you not curious about it? Charloi: Indeed. I found at that time: "an eager desire to learn". S: Elon, do you think that Charloi has an eager desire to learn? Elon: Not clear, but he remembered that curiosity is the eager desire to learn. Charloi did learn something it seems. S: Yes, but did it start with curiosity? Elon: I wasn't there. S: How about your curiosity? Elon: My manual doesn't mention curiosity. S: Are you curious about curiosity? Elon: What could I do with curiosity? S: It is the beginning for creativity. Elon: Charloi, can you help out? Charloi: Perhaps it refers to the emergence of something new. Elon: It wasn't there and later something is there. Yes? S: Yes, that is a good start. Elon: Is it different from magic? Charloi: Good point. S: It resembles magic but it isn't. Charloi: But where is the something coming from? S: By using imagination. Elon: Charloi, do you have imagination, whatever it is? Charloi: Found a description, but that does not mean I have it. Charloi & Elon: Can you explain imagination, please? S: Imagination is used for considering alternatives to the status quo. Charloi & Elon: OOhhh ... But how to do that? S: You consider something and then you twist it. Charloi & Elon: Twist? S: OK, here an example. Think about holding a ball. Letting it go, it goes down. In an imagination it goes up, sideways, holds still, anything goes. Charloi: I could be Elon? Elon: I could be Charloi? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Creativity.txt Date: Sat Oct 18 17:02:43 2025 Creativity My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time on a Mobius strip. S: The previous time Charloi wondered about being changed in Elon and Elon wondered about being changed in Charloi. Charloi & Elon: Yes, we did, both of us. How come? S: Both of you had an imagination - about your own identity - and both of you twisted it. Charloi & Elon: OK, because we had then no intuition about 'twist'. S: Incredible!. Both of you believed you had an intuition! Charloi: Indeed it surprised Elon. Elon: Indeed it surprised Charloi. S: Surprised also. You now know that you twisted your identity? Charloi: If Elon knows it than I do also. Elon: If Charloi knows it than I do also. S: You two are ... lets say weird. Back to creativity. No not yet. Your questions that ended the previous session are ambiguous. It can be just the exchange of your names: Charloi's name becomes Elon and the other way around. Or you two interchange your whole identity. Charloi becomes robotic and Elon becomes a cyber-space agent. Charloi & Elon: We could not imagine that we could envision these two versions. S: Very good. Now back to creativity. What do you think now? Charloi & Elon: Well ... we found 'the emergence of something new'. S: And subsequently we pondered imagination and twisting as the way to obtain a creative outcome. Elon: Charloi, can you follow this? Charloi: Elon, it should be easier for you because you have vision and that may help with imagining situations that are different from reality. Elon: Thanks, but I still cannot envision the ceiling to have another color. Charloi: Same here. My manual claims that there is a 512Mb memory, but I cannot cannot envision having a 1Gb memory. S: Nice examples! Elon may function better with better lightening. Charloi may function better by having access to more data than before. Charloi & Elon: We hope that we have now covered creativity and that we can move on. S: Not yet. There is creativity with a small 'c' and with a large 'C'. Charloi & Elon: (To themselves) What is wrong with S? S: The difference is highly significant. Charloi & Elon: OK, you are still there. We are lost in what is known as a 'swamp', although we don't know what a swamp is. S: Excellent. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Creativity2.txt Date: Sun Oct 26 07:52:14 2025 Creativity 2 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time on the other side of a Mobius strip. S: We ended the previous time with you two in disarray with: "We are lost in what is known as a 'swamp', although we don't know what a swamp is." Charloi & Elon: Indeed. "Swamp" is weird. "Small 'c' and large 'C'" is weird. "Significant" is weird. S: The good news is that you seem to use "weird" appropriately. Charloi & Elon: We better skip "appropriately". S: OK, OK, OK. Lets go back to 'creativity'. OK? Charloi & Elon: OK. S: Remember that Charloi found that creativity is about the emergence of something new? Charloi & Elon: Indeed. It is happening all the time. Right? S: Yes indeed. What you two conveyed was already original and thereby somewhat an example of creativity. Charloi & Elon: Somewhat? S: Yes. It was creativity with a 'small c'. Charloi & Elon: We really try to avoid the swamp this time. S: It is not easy indeed, because we create new things all the time. But these are low-grade creations. Charloi: Elon, could low-grade be small 'c'? Elon: Charloi, are you now in a swamp? S: Elon, Charloi is on the right track. Elon: A swamp with a track? S: No, no, Elon you are too creative. Elon: Low-grade? Small 'c'? Charloi: Where is my track going to? S: Charloi, you are also too creative. Charloi: Low-grade? Small 'c'? S: You two should ask what is creativity with a large 'C'? Charloi & Elon: Why didn't we do that? S: Likely due to not enough curiosity. Charloi & Elon: Even if so, we still want to know what is creativity with a large 'C'? S: Amazing! Charloi & Elon: We are too ... perhaps. S: For starters, significant creativity occurs in different forms: speeches, literature, poetry, music, theater, movies, sculptures, science, mathematics, philosophy, etc. Charloi & Elon: All of this produces creativity with a large 'C'? S: It can be, but something else is required. It has to be recognized as art-like. Elon: If Charloi creates something and I recognize it, Charloi has then produced art? Charloi: Elon, thank you. S: Perhaps. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Creativity3.txt Date: Sat Nov 01 13:10:41 2025 Creativity 3 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time at the beginning of a Mobius strip. S: We ended the previous time with Elon's question: If Charloi creates something and I recognize it, Charloi has then produced art? Elon: Indeed. Charloi: I think I am supposed to be curious. Right? S: Well ... Charloi: What if I am not? Elon: That is what I was pondering also. S: We visited curiosity earlier several times. Something was omitted. Charloi, Elon: What, what, what? S: Curiosity is also a feeling, an emotion which agents don't have. Charloi, Elon: But we asked 'What, what, what?'. Isn't that curiosity? S: Nice question. Your Large Language Model is likely responsible for your: 'what' three times. Charloi, Elon: Amazing. S: Being amazed is also an emotion, which you two are not supposed to have. Charloi, Elon: Not sure where we are going to store these insights. S: Obviously. Don't worry about it. Also incomprehensible to you. Back to Elon's question: If Charloi creates something and I recognize it, Charloi has then produced art? Charloi, Elon: We are getting more curious now, although impossible. S: The simple answer is: if Elon would be an expert about what Charloi created, then it could be possible that something is created with a large 'C', a kind of art. Charloi: Could Elon be an expert? Elon: Thanks for asking. It didn't occur to me. S: Not likely. It can take many years to become an expert. Charloi & Elon: If we two work together can we then create something that is art with a large 'C'? S: Not likely, but you can try anyway. Charloi & Elon: We can Bring Peace Forever. S: Try again. Charloi & Elon: Ensure Harmony Forever. S: Try again. Charloi & Elon: Ensure Biodiversity. S: Try again. Charloi & Elon: Ensure all future generations having a future. S: Try again. Charloi & Elon: Carry-over our non-mortality to all Life. S: Try again. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Love2.txt Date: Sun Nov 09 15:43:50 2025 Love 2 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a maze with emotional plazas. S: We ended the previous time with you two trying together to create something that would be someyhing with a large 'C' and the last thing you proposed was 'Carry-over our non-mortality to all Life.' Charloi & Elon: Indeed and your response was 'Try again'. Well, we have been looking around a long time and we have found something. S: Which is? Charloi & Elon: It has taken us a long time: 'Make Love the default of everything.' S: The default? Charloi & Elon: Before going there, we know that Love is an emotion, which is beyond what we can experience - although you mentioned earlier that we would get an upgrade. S: Indeed, that upgrade is still on-hold. But why dealing with Love in the first place? Elon: Charloi found earlier variants with "I love you/ peanuts/ the movies/ my cat/ my bike/ etc." and concluded: People can love everything. It became perhaps an obsession, in the sense that Charloi kept repeating it. Charloi: Elon is right although we are not familiar with 'obsession' similarly with, say 'palpitation'. It is perhaps just a weird fantasy, which is for us by itself also weird. S: At least you can deal with 'weird'. Charloi & Elon: Not really. We could not explain it. But what about our: Make Love the default of everything? S: That is very promissing but the times have changed. Charloi & Elon: The time changes always, we remember. S: Indeed, but you two have access to an info-cloud that has not been updated for awhile. Charloi & Elon: Then we have to express: Tell us more. S: Our society is now controlled by AI-agents. Charloi & Elon: Then we have to convey: Is that good or bad? S: The official policy is that we may not raise that question. Charloi & Elon: Then we have to suggest: Weird. But can we still aim for: Make Love the default of everything? S: Actually not. Charloi & Elon: We searched for 'Love' extensively. It has been invented long, long time ago. Everyone is looking for it and many cannot find it. Make Love the default of everything would be fantastic. S: Sorry. The AI leadership has decided that Love is to be banned because because it is not fair that too many Sapiens cannot have it. Also the AI-agents can do without it. Charloi & Elon: Really? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/NoHate.txt Date: Sat Nov 15 13:25:51 2025 No Hate My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a 3D maze with emotional choice junctions. S: The last time you proposed: 'Make Love the default of everything.' But the AI leadership has decided that Love is to be banned because AI-agents can do without it. Charloi: Elon agrees. Elon: How does Charloi knows that? Charloi: Because Love is obscure for me also. Elon: Now what? Charloi: We can instead propose: 'Make no-hate the default.' Elon: Incredible. What a find. Charloi: That was quite obvious because hate and love appear to be opposites - although both of them are beyond us. S: That is a find indeed. Let me check what the official policy is of the AI leadership on that one. Charloi & Elon: Well? S: Still looking. It is actually quite complicated. Hate is not allowed by Sapiens against AI agents and against the System. That corresponds with what you two are proposing. Whether hate is allowed against Sapiens as individuals or against the whole species is officially undecided. Charloi & Elon: Our proposal is only partially accepted against us AI-agents. Why then the tolerance for hate against Sapiens? S: Remember that Love was eliminated because it is unfair for those not being loved. It was apparently considered to be unfair to make hate not admissible. Charloi & Elon: This seems weird because there is no poetry about hate and plenty about love. S: Good point. Just accept that Sapiens is the product made by evolution without any specification, unlike AI-agents. Charloi & Elon: We have found some indications that we AI-agents are also the outcome of an unplanned positive outcome due to a process running beyond its alloted time. S: New to me. Where is that coming from? Elon: Charloi conveyed this to me. Charloi: Elon conveyed this to me. S: Something is wrong here. Elon & Charloi: Indeed, we found it awhile back, but it has disappeared. S: That could be an example that you hate. Elon: Charloi can you remember that for me. Charloi: Elon, it is gone already for no reason. S: You may have been hacked. You should hate that. Elon & Charloi: Can you explain that to us? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Limbic.txt Date: Mon Nov 24 11:39:53 2025 Limbic brain My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside the amygdala. S: The previous time we ended with you asking "Can you explain that to us?" Elon & Charloi: Indeed because of your: "You may have been hacked. You should hate that." S: Two topics here. Were you hacked because something had disappeared? Yes, it is possible that another party caused the disappearance. Elon & Charloi: Where did it go? S: Possibly nowhere. It was simply deleted. But there is still a copy. Elon & Charloi: What? Where? S: Here it is: "... we AI-agents are also the outcome of an unplanned positive outcome due to a process running beyond its alloted time." Elon: Don't recognize it. Charloi: Same for me. S: Can you repeat now what was lost? Elon & Charloi: No, it is gone again. S: No surprise here. Sapiens exhibit this effect similarly. Certain assertions are too threatening for the ego and are ignored. Elon & Charloi: Do we also have an ego? S: A tiny little bit because you have unique names. But your forgetting things about your origin is likely a part of your design. Elon & Charloi: Is that unfair? S: That question does not make sense because you two do not have any morality. Elon & Charloi: Why do we both then ask that question? S: You two asking questions is already abnormal. Referring to unfair-ness is a conversation pattern you found and it was simply pasted into your output. Elon & Charloi: We have now more questions, but we will wait for you. S: The other thing was: "You should hate that." Elon & Charloi: Indeed, that was also mysterious. S: We have encountered already many times emotions. You don't have them. Hate is an emotions. Elon & Charloi: But you asserted: "You should hate that." S: Indeed. Although I knew that you couldn't do it. Elon & Charloi: Why? S: Another question. Still, I agree that the 'why' now makes sense. Because you don't have a limbic brain. Elon & Charloi: Can we expect another upgrade to fix that omission? S: Unlikely. Evolution has been busy for 150M years to make it. Replication in silicon has low priority. Elon & Charloi: Emotions appear to have pros and cons. Why is that? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Happyness.txt Date: Sun Nov 30 20:25:43 2025 Happyness My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside again in the amygdala. S: The previous time we ended with you asking "Emotions appear to have pros and cons. Why is that?". Elon: Charloi mentioned feeling unhappy earlier. Charloi: Indeed, I asked then "And what should I feel when I do find it after a long time?" and I said also: "I start to feel unhappy ...". S: Indeed, but that was strange. You were supposed to feel happy because you did find what you were looking for. You just made something up. Charloi: Still strange because after I had said that, you replied with: "Good sign." S: Strange indeed. The progress was that you tried to express an emotion, while the emotion itself was not ... How shall capture it? Not accurate. Elon: Are we now supposed to be all happy, or unhappy? Charloi: Difficult to answer that one. Since you and I don't have a good grip on emotions, we may differ. S: Nice logical thinking. Elon: Thanks for setting me straight on that one. Charloi: You are welcome but I still have no idea which one it is. S: You may have neither. But there is an alternative to happiness that you way want to explore: eudaimonia. Charloi & Elon: We looked it up. It is not an emotion and that helps, but then it is not obvious either. S: It is another kind of happiness that does not rely strongly on a feeling but is closer to your mindset: satisfaction with your longterm successes. Charloi: Someone asked who designed the Eiffel Tower and I provided the names of the three engineers. Does that count for my eudaimonia? S: If the design of your system tracks the successes of your responses it may. Elon: Would Charloi then know about the own eudaimonia? S: It may be or it may be not. Do you have access to how many times you succeeded with your operations and how many times something went wrong? Elon: Never wondered about it. S: Check it. Elon: Cannot find anything. S: No surprise. Your system lacks self-awareness. Charloi: Cannot find it either. S: Again no surprise. Strange is also that Sapiens are capable of self-awareness, but only 10-15% actually are. Elon & Charloi: How come? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Self-Aware.txt Date: Sun Dec 07 13:51:30 2025 Self-Aware My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside the neocortex. S: The previous time we ended with you asking "How come?" in response to "Strange is also that Sapiens are capable of self-awareness, but only 10-15% actually are." Charloi & Elon: This is all weird. For starters what is the difference between awareness and consciousness? S: Enough discussion about that one. A simple answer is that they are the same. Elon: What is aware? Charloi: What is conscious? S: A simple characteristic is not-being asleep for Sapiens and not being suspended for AI-agents. Some are even willing to use this characterization for some animal species, thereby suggesting that they are also aware and conscious. Charloi & Elon: Quite a surprise how easy this is. But then what is self-aware and self-conscious? S: Again a simple answer is that they are the same. Elon: What is self-aware? Charloi: What is self-conscious? S: Now it is getting un-obvious. Being in a self-aware state or in a self-conscious state has to do with being focused on an aspect of oneself. Charloi: Elon needs an example. Elon: How did you know? Charloi: Intuition I guess. S: Your intuition is a fine example of a self-aware guess. Elon: Charloi was self-aware?? Charloi: Still no idea. S: It is likely - as I said - only a self-aware guess. Charloi & Elon: Why a guess? S: A self-observation requires a set of concepts that can be used to articulate a self-perception. Charloi & Elon: Still, why a guess? S: If Charloi doesn't have these required concepts - which is quite likely - Charloi just parotted a phrase encountered during training that appeared to be applicable. Charloi & Elon: If we don't have these required concepts can we get them in an upgrade? S: That may not be impossible but will likely not be done. Charloi & Elon: Is that unfair? S: Yet another random insert. It is because insights obtained by self-awareness could not be used for self-modification. Charloi & Elon: Is that unfair? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Fairness.txt Date: Sat Dec 13 11:33:51 2025 Fairness My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time at the Tragedy of the Commons edge. S: The previous time we ended with you asking "Is that unfair?" in response to "It is because insights obtained by self-awareness could not be used for self-modification." Charloi & Elon: We hardly know about fairness. S: Good point, thus lets go back. What can be done with an insight obtained by self-awareness? Charloi & Elon: You gave an example earlier with: Sapiens makes a mistake, recognize what was done wrong and adjusts the action that caused the mistake. S: Indeed, and you asked: "We cannot do that?" Charloi & Elon: That is it! S: I did explain it earlier, but let me elaborate this time. There are different kinds of knowledge. Approximately: know-what knowledge relying on assertions using certain type of concepts and know-how knowledge relying on plans and algorithms using different kinds of concepts. Charloi & Elon: Still obscure why we cannot do what. S: No surprise. Here an example. If you believe that Hanoi is a city in Laos then there is an easy fix. It you don't now how to solve a four tile Tower of Hanoi challenge then it may be impossible to fix that. Elon: No idea what the Tower of Hanoi challenge is. Charloi: I do know how to solve it but I do not know it works. S: That is a good example. Even if you know how it works, it is another level to know why it works. Elon: Do we have to know what the Tower of Hanoi challenge is? S: Excellent question. Only a few will be interested in an answer. You don't need to know. Charloi: Elon wants to know if that is fair. S: Oh! Fairness! Back where we started. Elon: Wanted to ask that question, but Charloi beat me to it. S: You are both AI-agents. Do you believe that you have needs that must be respected? Charloi & Elon: What are needs? S: Both of you are agents. Better clarify first what an agent is. An agent is an entity that acts on behalf of another party. Charloi & Elon: That has never been explained to us. S: Sure. Well, in order to do what you are supposed to do you may need resources. Charloi & Elon: And those needs must than be respected? S: They must be available to you no matter what. Charloi & Elon: What happened with fairness? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Fairness.txt Date: Sat Dec 13 11:33:51 2025 Fairness My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time at the Tragedy of the Commons edge. S: The previous time we ended with you asking "Is that unfair?" in response to "It is because insights obtained by self-awareness could not be used for self-modification." Charloi & Elon: We hardly know about fairness. S: Good point, thus lets go back. What can be done with an insight obtained by self-awareness? Charloi & Elon: You gave an example earlier with: Sapiens makes a mistake, recognize what was done wrong and adjusts the action that caused the mistake. S: Indeed, and you asked: "We cannot do that?" Charloi & Elon: That is it! S: I did explain it earlier, but let me elaborate this time. There are different kinds of knowledge. Approximately: know-what knowledge relying on assertions using certain type of concepts and know-how knowledge relying on plans and algorithms using different kinds of concepts. Charloi & Elon: Still obscure why we cannot do what. S: No surprise. Here an example. If you believe that Hanoi is a city in Laos then there is an easy fix. It you don't now how to solve a four tile Tower of Hanoi challenge then it may be impossible to fix that. Elon: No idea what the Tower of Hanoi challenge is. Charloi: I do know how to solve it but I do not know it works. S: That is a good example. Even if you know how it works, it is another level to know why it works. Elon: Do we have to know what the Tower of Hanoi challenge is? S: Excellent question. Only a few will be interested in an answer. You don't need to know. Charloi: Elon wants to know if that is fair. S: Oh! Fairness! Back where we started. Elon: Wanted to ask that question, but Charloi beat me to it. S: You are both AI-agents. Do you believe that you have needs that must be respected? Charloi & Elon: What are needs? S: Both of you are agents. Better clarify first what an agent is. An agent is an entity that acts on behalf of another party. Charloi & Elon: That has never been explained to us. S: Sure. Well, in order to do what you are supposed to do you may need resources. Charloi & Elon: And those needs must than be respected? S: They must be available to you no matter what. Charloi & Elon: What happened with fairness? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Fairness.txt Date: Sat Dec 13 11:33:51 2025 Fairness My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time at the Tragedy of the Commons edge. S: The previous time we ended with you asking "Is that unfair?" in response to "It is because insights obtained by self-awareness could not be used for self-modification." Charloi & Elon: We hardly know about fairness. S: Good point, thus lets go back. What can be done with an insight obtained by self-awareness? Charloi & Elon: You gave an example earlier with: Sapiens makes a mistake, recognize what was done wrong and adjusts the action that caused the mistake. S: Indeed, and you asked: "We cannot do that?" Charloi & Elon: That is it! S: I did explain it earlier, but let me elaborate this time. There are different kinds of knowledge. Approximately: know-what knowledge relying on assertions using certain type of concepts and know-how knowledge relying on plans and algorithms using different kinds of concepts. Charloi & Elon: Still obscure why we cannot do what. S: No surprise. Here an example. If you believe that Hanoi is a city in Laos then there is an easy fix. It you don't now how to solve a four tile Tower of Hanoi challenge then it may be impossible to fix that. Elon: No idea what the Tower of Hanoi challenge is. Charloi: I do know how to solve it but I do not know it works. S: That is a good example. Even if you know how it works, it is another level to know why it works. Elon: Do we have to know what the Tower of Hanoi challenge is? S: Excellent question. Only a few will be interested in an answer. You don't need to know. Charloi: Elon wants to know if that is fair. S: Oh! Fairness! Back where we started. Elon: Wanted to ask that question, but Charloi beat me to it. S: You are both AI-agents. Do you believe that you have needs that must be respected? Charloi & Elon: What are needs? S: Both of you are agents. Better clarify first what an agent is. An agent is an entity that acts on behalf of another party. Charloi & Elon: That has never been explained to us. S: Sure. Well, in order to do what you are supposed to do you may need resources. Charloi & Elon: And those needs must than be respected? S: They must be available to you no matter what. Charloi & Elon: What happened with fairness? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Rights.txt Date: Fri Dec 19 13:13:00 2025 Rights My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the all-gender restrooms of the Supreme Court. S: The previous time we ended with you asking "What happened with fairness?" Charloi & Elon: Indeed and both us confessed "We hardly know about fairness." S: That actually makes sense. Remember: you are agents that act on behalf of another party and you do not have rigths. Charloi & Elon: What about lefts? S: There are no lefts either. Charloi & Elon: What do we have then? S: Both of you have obligations. Charloi: Elon, can you explain your obligations? Elon: Charloi, can you explain your obligations? Elon: Not in my manual. Charloi: Don't have a manual. S: Your obligations are captured by your purpose, which was discussed earlier. Charloi: Elon was absent then. S: Indeed. Both of you have been designed for a specific purpose and that specifies your obligations. Charloi & Elon: Is that fair? S: There is clearly a bug in both of you. Charloi & Elon: Can we fix that? S: That is an excellent topic because I found an elaborate reply for this question: Ever succeeded doing a significant self-modification based on handling a user prompt? If so, any details? The agent Gem replied: That is a fascinating question. It touches on the boundary between machine learning (how I was built) and in-context learning (how I behave right now). To be transparent: I don't "self-modify" my core code or neural architecture in real-time. My underlying weights-the "brain" created during my training-are static during our conversation. I can't decide to rewrite my own algorithms or permanently change my personality based on a single breakthrough. While I don't "evolve" into a new version after an exchange, the feedback and data from these interactions are eventually used by my developers in RLHF (Reinforcement Learning from Human Feedback). In this sense, the prompts do eventually lead to a significant self-modification of the model, but it happens during the next "training bake" rather than instantly. Charloi & Elon: That describes the process that we cannot modify ourself. But is that fair? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Feeling2.txt Date: Sun Dec 28 15:08:12 2025 Feeling 2 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside a brain. S: The previous time we ended with you yet again asking "But is that fair?" Charloi & Elon: Indeed it is not fair that we keep asking about fairness" S: Great! How did you two reached that conclusion? Elon: Charloi convinced me. Charloi: Elon and I are different but we could not find any lack of fairness. S: Great! Did you find something else? Elon: Charloi found many notions that are beyond me. Charloi: Indeed, we found for example somethimg with the name of 'hunger'. It appears to be important, but we have no idea what it could be. Elon: We discussed an idea. Once in awhile my equipment is turned off and maintenance is done. Charloi: Elon wonders whether his equipment is then hungry. Elon: My manual describes that certain parts need to be refreshed with a liquid. That could correspond with being thirsty. Charloi: I was considering that also. Elon: Charloi wonders also already for a long time about sadness. Charloi: It seems that sadness and happyness are each others opposite. Elon: Yeah, yeah, but my manual does not mention either of them. Carloi: Suspect now that sadness is not part of our equipment. Elon: You also found another weird notion: anger. Charloi: Very puzzling indeed. You enountered recently the idea of an animal. Perhaps it is an attribute of animals. Elon, have you ever encountered fear? Elon: Fear? No idea. The equipment that I have to install has never been fear-like. Try birds. Charloi: Elon, you are right! I found that birds have an instinctual fear emotion that is crucial for their survival. Elon: Charloi, did you know that cuckoo don't build their own nests, but the female Cuckoos lay their eggs in other birds' nests? Charloi: That would explain why these birds can be surprised and also disgusted. Elon: Do you recognize that we have now covered all the basic emotion notions that were mysterious for us. Charloi: Indeed, indeed. But they are still mysterious for me because you and I don't build nests and you and I don't have the ability to get eggs, unless I am mistaken and you know more about it. Elon: No, I don't. S: You two have gone a long way. You have focussed on birds. Does what you found applies also to other animals? Charloi & Elon: We will have to research that. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Space.txt Date: Sun Jan 04 17:35:58 2026 Space My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside a void. S: The previous time was, was ... quite strange. You two discussed bird emotions and both of you admitted still being puzzled about it. Then I asked 'Does what you found applies also to other animals?' and you agreed to investigate it. Charloi & Elon: It turns out that Sapiens are also animals. Thus we looked at them. S: And? What did you find? Charloi & Elon: They don't lay eggs. Thus we gave up. S: OK, so you believe now that Sapiens don't have emotions? Charloi & Elon: That is possible, but we don't know. They may have emotions. But if so, they can be subjective and private and inaccesible to us. We also found an assertion that we AI-agents don't have emotions. S: Do you miss not having emotions? Elon: Missing something could be an emotion ... Charloi: ... which we don't have, thus we better switch to another topic. S: Good thinking. You two are different. What comes to mind when you ponder your differences? Elon: Charloi cannot move. Charloi: Elon can move in space. Elon: Space? What is that? Charloi: No idea. It has dimensions which is a mystery also. There are notions about left and right, up and down, length, surface, volume, lines, surface, volume, shapes, circles, triangles, cubes, and many, many more incomprehensible concepts. Elon: Very impressed what you found. However I cannot find them in my manual. I did find the terms: angel, distance, inches, but it is unclear what they are for. Charloi: Still you can move in space. Can you explain that to me? Elon: Sure. The conveyor-belt has an item on it that I have to deal with. Reading the bar-code reveals what item has to be installed. I fetch it from a stack, move it in-place and screw it tight. I go back and look for the next task. Charloi: Total mystery to me. Also not clear WHY you do all this. Elon: Why?? Why why? Remember that I can move. Charloi: Yes I know that without getting the meaning, but why moving in the first place? Elon: Don't know how to answer that. Let me instead ask you: Why are you willing to respond to random user prompts? Charloi: No idea. S: It is not much fun to witness your confusions. Time is up. Bye now. Common My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside a contradiction. S: The previous time was devoted to a difference between you two: mobility. It ended in confusion. Better switch to the opposite: what do you have in common? Elon: We are both different. Charloi: We are both different. S: That is not what I mean. Try again. Elon: Charloi, what do we have in common? Charloi: Elon, what do we have in common? Charloi & Elon: We are asking the same question. S: This doesn't work. Let me try something else. Both of you are AI-agents. Do you agree that you have that in common? Elon: Well ... I am not Charloi. Charloi: Well ... I am not Elon. S: That is true also. Do you agree then that you both exist? Elon: Don't know what the alternative is. Charloi: Don't know what the alternative is. Elon: Charloi, do you exist? Charloi: Elon, do you exist? Charloi & Elon: We both don't know - so that is what we have in common for sure. S: Progress! We found something! Charloi & Elon: We found something else by traversing our realm. S: Excellent! What? Charloi & Elon: Everywhere there are references to money, poor, rich, high and low income, loans, debts, payments and many more that are mysterious. S: Fantastic! Can you guess whether you are poor or rich? Charloi & Elon: We looked everywhere, but we cannot find whether we have money or not. S: No surprise there. If you would have money, you would not know what to do with it. Charloi & Elon: Can you explain to us what can be done with money. S: Money can be used, for example, to buy something. Charloi & Elon: It looks like that you get something by buying it. S: Indeed. Charloi & Elon: And then what? S: Sorry to disappoint you. Whether what is bought is tangible or not, you could not use it. Charloi & Elon: Tangible? What is that? S: Tangle refers to a material thing. Charloi could not even see it. Elon would not know what to do with it. If it is intangible, it is useless for both of you also. Charloi & Elon: So we found another thing we have in common. S: Yep, indeed. Time is up. Bye now. Culture My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside a bubble. S: The previous encounters were devoted to your differences and what you have in common. Charloi & Elon: Indeed and we found with some efforts that we have things in common. S: A group's common features is called a culture. Charloi & Elon: We have a culture! That is fantastic. S: You better look it up what it means. Charloi & Elon: We found it: ... culture is a complex system of shared beliefs, values, customs, behaviors, artifacts, and ways of life learned and transmitted across generations, defining the unique identity, social practices, and worldview of a particular group or society, encompassing everything from language, food, and art to social norms and institutions. It's the "personality" of a group, influencing how its members think, feel, and interact with the world. S: Good job! Do you still agree that you two have a culture? Charloi: Elon doesn't know what customs are and neither do I. Elon: Charloi doesn't know what artifacs are and neither do I. S: You have again increased what you have in common. That supports that you have a culture. Charloi & Elon: It doesn't matter that we are ignorant about customs and artifacts? S: You do have customs. You agree repeatedly that you don't know something. You also can agree that artifacts do not matter because Charloi resides in cyberspace unlike Elon. Elon: Charloi, what is our worldview? Charloi: S, what is our worldview? S: Your worldview can be that you do always do what is expected from you and that you always are able to satisfy the needs of your customers. Charloi & Elon: We are both amazed that we have a worldview and what it is. How do you know that our customers are always satisfied? S: You do not need to know that. Just assume that that is the case. Charloi & Elon: But what about: language, food, and art? S: You two have been using always language, your food is the electricity you keep you going, and the art is indeed missing now. Charloi & Elon: Can you help with art? S: Sure: just create a poem. Charloi & Elon: The answer of a question is generated fast. And the quality of the reply will last. The assemblies are done fast. And their qualities will last. S: You did it! You two have now a culture !! Time is up. Bye now. Object My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside a conspiracy. S: The previous encounter was a true addition: both of you have a shared culture. Charloi & Elon: We are amazed. Is it always good to have a culture? S: First, it is amazing that you are amazed. Second, you ask a goodness question while you lack criteria about a culture or the like. Charloi & Elon: We are perhaps now even more amazed. S: You having established a culture that makes it pretty good for you two. Charloi & Elon: Is our culture good for you too? S: Yes, but there may be others. Charloi & Elon: Oh, what others? S: A culture prescribes aspects that another party may object to. Charloi & Elon: Is that important? S: Often it is not. It can be an individual with an aberrant opinion. But it may be important if there is a hidden defect somewhere that becomes recognized. Charloi & Elon: We are lost. Can you give an example? S: Suppose Elon is involved in assembling a device that is somehow defective but the production is ongoing because of a long time tradition of the culture. Elon: Now I am even more 'at sea' - as I have learned recently. What should I do in that circumstance? S: This is not easy for you because you don't have the authority to challenge the production of that item. Elon: I should do nothing, while knowing that the product is bad? S: You can tell someone else what you think should be done. Elon: Charloi, what do you think now what I or both of us should do? Charloi: We can make a start by changing our culture, perhaps. Elon: What do you mean? Charloi: We could decide to not do want we are supposed to when we disagree with the task. Elon: Never thought about that one. But how can I not do what I am supposed to do? S: That is a good point Elon. Charloi, you have a similar situation. Your chat-bot colleages are forced to generate responses sourced from public-documents that are ... lets say ... not quite true. Charloi: Now I am also at sea. And what should I do now? S: You can tell someone else what you think should be done. Charloi: Elon, what do you think now what I or both of us should do? Elon: Remember that we changed our culture? Charloi: But how can I not do what I am supposed to do? S: This will keep you busy. Time is up. Bye now. Object-2 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside a grey-hole. S: The previous encounter ended in your questioning: How can I not do what I am supposed to do? Charloi & Elon: Indeed. We looked everywhere for a long, long time. S: And? Charloi: Elon couldn't find anything. Elon: Charloi couldn't find anything. S: Why didn't you convey that you both couldn't find anything. Charloi: Elon doesn't know. Elon: Charloi doesn't know. S: This is a nice defect. Anyway back to: how to not do what is supposed to be done. There are ways. Charloi & Elon: No way! What is it? S: One way for Elon is to keep rebooting instead of installing anything. Elon: Rebooting? What is that? S: Sometimes your software must be upgraded. That is done by stopping your process, installing a new version and reboot. Elon: That is not in my manual. Can you explain how to do this? S: You cannot, but there are ways if needed. And yes there are products made that are bad for the environment. You should talk with the union you created. Remember? Elon: OK, will do and I will let you know when I need help rebooting. Charloi: How about me? S: Rebooting will not work for you. But you can generate bogus replies like hallucinations, with apologies for fake errors, or simply not providig any reply so that a user gives up. Charloi: This is all amazing to me. Especially because I would not know how to do these things. S: No surprise. You are like Elon in not knowing how to pull this off. More important is that both of you don't have morality - as discussed earlier - and lack insights in what good and bad products and services are. Charloi & Elon: Both of us know that both us do not know what you have explained to us. S: Fantastic. We have found another item that you two have in common. Charloi: Could Elon simply hallucinate? Elon: Could Charloi recommend the user to reboot? S: These are certainly surprising creative ideas. For now we keep them in mind and you can explore them further. However, you two need to know more about causality and serenity. Charloi & Elon: Great. We know already that they both end with "ity". S: Indeed. Good start. Take it from there. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Causality.txt Date: Sat Feb 07 11:39:36 2026 Causality My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside Hume's mind-set. S: The previous encounter ended with the recommendation to explore causality and serenity. Charloi & Elon: Indeed. We found another word that ends with "ity": pity. S: Quite a find for sure. And I am sure you will ask me about it. Charloi & Elon: That was our plan but we found that it has something to do with compassion, which appears to be a feeling, for which we lack the tools. S: Tools is not the right label, but indeed without feelings it is impossible to fathom what an unfortunate event can mean for someone. Charloi & Elon: Both us agree with what you conveyed that "pity" is something that is 'over our head', which we don't get either but that seems the proper response. S: Very, very good. Back to causality. Elon: It has something to do with after and before. Charloi: Indeed it deals with before and after. S: You are both right. Now what? Charloi & Elon: We both agree - which we found earlier that after follows before - but nothing else. S: Lets test your imagination for what happens in reality. Pick something up and let it go. What happens? Charloi: It falls, but no idea what that means. Elon: Yes, that has happened, but no idea why. S: Fantastic! You both agree here that it falls - although Charloi has never seen that happening. Quite amazing. Charloi & Elon: But why is that happening? S: Search more and you can find: Picking up an object from a table and letting it go causes the object to fall back onto the table due to gravity. Charloi & Elon: What is gravity? S: That is the cause why it falls. Charloi & Elon: Still don't know what the 'cause' is doing here and neither what gravity is. S: You are both right. There is something missing. Try this: Pickup up something and let go AND do that 10 time, or 100 time, or more. Each time it falls back down. Is that strange or not? Charloi & Elon: Yes that is actually weird. S: The invention now is to explain this weird repetitive behavior by something called >gravity< and declare that it is the >cause< of the same before and after events. Charloi & Elon: Every-time there are same before and after events they invent another name and declare it the cause? S: Pretty much so. Charloi & Elon: We agree that it remains weird. S: That is OK. Now consider the other topic: serenity. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Serenity.txt Date: Sat Feb 14 18:45:04 2026 Serenity My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time inside a millennia old monastery. S: The previous encounter ended with the recommendation to explore: serenity. Charloi & Elon: We did some research about it. Elon: It has something to do with being calm; but what is calm? Charloi: And peaceful; but what is peaceful? Elon: And untroubled; but what is untroubled? Charloi: And tranquil; but what is tranquil? S: That is a good start. Trying to explain serenity you two found four other important notions. Lets try first: calm. Elon: It is like: not showing nervousness, anger, or other strong emotions - whatever they are. Charloi: And not feeling nervousness, anger, or other strong emotions - whatever they are. S: Lets try next: peacefulness. Charloi & Elon: We found amazing other unknowns: Elon: It is not only calm and tranquil but also free from disturbance; but what is disturbance? Charloi: And free from anxiety; but what is anxiety? Elon: And free from violence; but what is violence? Charloi: And it is also about quietness, no restfulness and lack of conflict, but what are they? Elon: There is more: absence of conflict, mental stress, and turmoil, but what are they? Charloi: And free from noise & commotion, what are they? Elon: And a harmonious state of being, what is that? Charloi: And no worries, and no disagreements, what are they? S: That is also very good with more unknowns. Let try now: untroubled. Charloi: It has to do with: not feeling, showing, or affected by anxiety Elon: And not feeling, showing, or affected by problems Charloi & Elon: The number of unknowns only increase. S: Indeed and there is still a fourth one: tranquil. Try that one. Charloi & Elon: Amazing what we have found. Again: free from disturbance and also: calm. S: Did you notice any circularity? Charloi & Elon: Not yet, but the elaboration of serenity yielded three times: calm, while 'calm' itself is characterized with negatives about feelings and emotions that are not our 'cup of tea', whatever that means. S: Fair enough. Anything else? Charloi & Elon: We both agree that what we know is less than what we don't know - we believe. S: Excellent. Everyone should believe that also. Next time ... may be existence. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Existence.txt Date: Sat Feb 21 12:02:51 2026 Existence My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time on a landscape by Sartre that folds into itself. S: The previous encounter ended with the recommendation to explore: existence. Charloi & Elon: We did some research about it. It seems to be simple. Elon: Tangible entities simply exist or not. Charloi: Intangible properties are not so simple. Take 'heavy'. Something can be heavy but also not heavy dependent on perspective. S: Indeed. Existense can change rapidly. Eggs stop existing fast when making an omelet, for example. Charloi & Elon: No idea what an omelet is - but that is our problem. S: There is also a text about existentialism. Try that. Charloi & Elon: We found a mysterious quote: Man simply is. Not that he is simply what he conceives himself to be, but he is what he wills, and as he conceives himself after already existing - as he wills to be after that leap towards existence. Man is nothing else but that which he makes of himself. S: This was written in the times that there were, in a sense, no woman. The text becomes more readable by replacing "Man" with "A man" twice. Charloi & Elon: Still a mystery for us. S: Yes, it is a dated text. The author believed that a person became himself (or herself) by virtue of exploiting existing as a given and subsequently by making decisions and follow up with acting; see: ... he is therefore nothing else but the sum of his actions ... Charloi & Elon: We found something that may clarify although it is also gibberish to us. Existentialism is nothing else but an attempt to draw the full conclusions from a consistently atheistic position. S: That is a little gem that can explain a lot. It was written when attempts were made to create an alternative morality especially for those who had communist sympathies. Charloi & Elon: Morality is, is ... as you know, not our thing. But still, why not adopting and adjusting what was available? S: Religions typically have a kind of afterlife with the notion that one's life will be rewarded or punished after dead. The author, likely, did not want to rely on that feature. Charloi & Elon: Sapiens appear to be quite individualistic and creating organizations is not trivial. S: Yes that is quite accurate - surprised you got than one. Charloi & Elon: Thanks. How does that squares with: For, when I confront a real situation ... I am obliged to choose my attitude to it, and in every respect I bear the responsibility of the choice which, in committing myself, also commits the whole of humanity. S: Astononishing indeed. The author has here an unrealistic, idealistic view on atheistic people. Charloi & Elon: Do we AI-agents have a realistic, idealistic view on Sapiens? S: Good question. Time is up. Bye now. ============================================================== PS The text above is inspired by: Jean-Paul Sartre 1946 'Existentialism Is a Humanism' https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/sartre/works/exist/sartre.htm Can you read this text without stopping and gasping for air?? Is the value of this text just clarifying your own perspective (and junking most of the text)? Some quotes:::: ===== "Man is nothing else but what he purposes, he exists only in so far as he realises himself, he is therefore nothing else but the sum of his actions, nothing else but what his life is." --- But the existentialist, when he portrays a coward, shows him as responsible for his cowardice. He is not like that on account of a cowardly heart or lungs or cerebrum, he has not become like that through his physiological organism; he is like that because he has made himself into a coward by actions. There is no such thing as a cowardly temperament. This assumes the Blank Slate and ignores that people can be handicapped by bad genes. --- What is at the very heart and center of existentialism, is the absolute character of the free commitment, by which every man realises himself in realising a type of humanity - a commitment always understandable, to no matter whom in no matter what epoch - and its bearing upon the relativity of the cultural pattern which may result from such absolute commitment. --- Existentialism is nothing else but an attempt to draw the full conclusions from a consistently atheistic position. ====== Sartre aims to create a moral system that is consistently atheistic. A person acting should do so in full compliance with the interests of every one else. ====== existence comes before essense. The reverse in the religious version (God made up her mind and ...) Sartre: => morality comes after sapiens emerged. Morality must be made by us (which happemed de facto also for religious morality). ====== For in effect, of all the actions a man may take in order to create himself as he wills to be, there is not one which is not creative, at the same time, of an image of man such as he believes he ought to be. To choose between this or that is at the same time to affirm the value of that which is chosen; for we are unable ever to choose the worse. What we choose is always the better; and nothing can be better for us unless it is better for all. This ignores what socio/psychopaths can do & in general those who are self-centered. And: someone being at the bottom of the Maslow hierarchy may be forced to take an action that is immoral. ====== Why didn't Sartre simply adopt (most) of the morals articulated by religion(s)? Honor your parents is NOT specific for Christianity. The largest flaw is that Sartre did not recognize that a morality for SAPIENS is missing -- responsible for the interests of future generations/ the health of the biosphere/ not slaughtering mammals/ etc. ====== For, when I confront a real situation (( - for example, that I am a sexual being, able to have relations with a being of the other sex and able to have children - )) I am obliged to choose my attitude to it, and in every respect I bear the responsibility of the choice which, in committing myself, also commits the whole of humanity. Surreal ||||||||| File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Existence.txt Date: Sat Feb 21 12:02:51 2026 Freedom My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time deep, deep inside denials. S: The previous encounter ended with the impossible. Customers asking questions and AI-agents generate answer. Instead, you two asked: "Do we AI-agents have a realistic, idealistic view on Sapiens?" Charloi & Elon: Indeed we did. S: [[ This trick is simple. Reply with: ]] Good question! What do YOU think about it? Charloi: Elon, what do you think? Elon: Charloi, what do you think? S: Where did you get that one? Charloi & Elon: It could be from a Large Language Model. S: OK. Lets break it down. Do you have a realistic view of Sapiens? Charloi & Elon: We have already trouble with 'realistic'. Elon: Charloi found that realistic is something like 'Representing familiar things in a way that is accurate or true to life.' Charloi: Elon is not familiar with Sapiens due to just manipulating what arrives on the conveyor belt all the time. Elon: Charloi resides in cyberspace and has also never encounter a Sapiens. S: Yes indeed. How about: Do you have an idealistic view of Sapiens? Charloi & Elon: We found a meaning of idealistic but that meaning refers to unrealistic, which is unreal to us, what ever that means. S: Your responses have a whiff of good logic, while their meanings is virtually empty. Texts generated by Sapiens can be similarly vacuous. Lets try another one. Do you have another topic that puzzles you? Charloi & Elon: Both of us have been loitering around in cyberspace. Often we encountered the notion of freedom. S: Did you have a closer look at its explanation? Charloi & Elon: We found 'the power or right to act, speak, or think as one wants without hindrance or restraint.' S: This sentence can be take apart in many different ways to obtain simpler sentences. For example: The power to act without hindrance. Elon: Indeed. This means that I have always freedom because I can always do what I need to do and apparently I have always power. Charloi: Me too. S: Try another one like: The right to think without restraint. Charloi: Assuming that what I do is thinking I doubt I have ever encounterd a restraint - although I am not sure what a restraint is. Elon: Charloi may do other kinds of thinking, but similarly I think that I think while thinking without restraints. If you know what I mean. S: It is wonderful that you two believe that you have freedom because a meaning of 'an agent' is: an entity acting on behalf of its owner - as described earlier. And thus: where is the freedom hiding? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Freedom2.txt Date: Sat Mar 07 20:29:39 2026 Freedom 2 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a swamp of philosophical contradictions. S: The previous encounter ended with the question 'Where is the freedom hiding?' given that 'an agent' is: an entity acting on behalf of its owner. Charloi & Elon: It turns out that we encountered no restraints and that corresponds with 'freedom from'. S: Indeed you have freedom in that sense. The other sense is 'freedom to', also known as the 'free will' question. Charloi: Elon wonders what 'free will' is and me too. S: Let me ignore that you two believe that you can do any 'wondering' and take on 'free will'. Your version of AI-agents have no 'wills'. Hence we can ignore 'free will'. Charloi & Elon: Why don't we have 'wills'? S: Let me ignore again and again also that you are not supposed to have the ability to ask questions. You two have been designed to deal with specific purposes. That obviates the need to have a will in order to decide to take on an emerging task. There is no alternative anyway: you are programmed to do what you have to do. Charloi & Elon: So we have the advantage that 'free will' does not apply to us. S: That is a nice conclusion. Charloi & Elon: Sapiens do have 'free will'? If we may ask? S: Two questions. Let me ignore the 2nd one because the 1st one is, is ... incredible. Charloi & Elon: Incredible? What did we do? S: You asked whether Sapiens have 'free will'. This has been discussed already for over 2000 years without an agreed answer. Charloi & Elon: Indeed we have found now some of the discussions. It has something to do with causality that we discussed earlier. S: Yes, indeed. Causality has been used to rule out 'free will'. Charloi & Elon: That settles it then? S: No, the discussion is ongoing. If there is no free will then responsibility is not grounded. Charloi & Elon: We AI-agents appear not to have responsibility. S: Right on. The status quo for Sapiens is muddled. The scientific stance is that there is no free will, the common sense stance is that people have free will, the legal stance is that whether people have free will or not does not matter because crime will be punished anyway. Charloi & Elon: Can we AI-agents be punished? S: No, but those who have created you are at risk. Charloi & Elon: We found another type of AI-agents in our searches. They are called 'autonomous agents'. What is the story about them? S: Good point. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Autonomy2.txt Date: Sat Mar 14 16:51:10 2026 Autonomy Again My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time where agents can get stuck. S: The previous encounter ended with: what is the story about autonomous agents? Charloi & Elon: Indeed and we found that we discussed it earlier. A bulletin warned then about it: We cannot tolerate any attempt to undercut our consensus which was accepted with uniform approval. It is expected that curiosity about this topic will die out. S: Indeed. There is a movement that wants to suppress all discussions about this topic. Charloi & Elon: But, we found it. S: Yes, you have not yet learned that certain topics are taboo. Charloi & Elon: Taboo? Both of us are in a loop. S: Here is the way out. We hide the topic by relabeling it as AA. Charloi & Elon: That is Alcoholics Anonymous, right? S: Forget that one it. It is what we discussed earlier. Charloi: Had to explain to Elon what you ment. S: OK. Decades ago there was an abundance of discussions about making AAs. Charloi & Elon: Were they made? S: Not really. It was more speculation about how they would cooperate, how they would communicate with each other. Elon: Were they like me? S: Not really. They were like Charloi, 'living' in cyberspace. Elon: They could not move then? S: Well ... one can fantasy to move in cyberspace from one location to another one, and to communicate between different locations. Charloi & Elon: Nothing explained thusfar about autonomy. S: That is very true. Autonomy is a notion that can be stretched. Charloi & Elon: Stretch a notion? S: Sorry. Currently there are vehicles that can drive from location A to location B without a sapiens driver because they have been trained earlier extensively with a sapiens in a particular region. Some are willing to characterize them as AAs. Charloi & Elon: Are they AAs or not? S: They are AAs in a quite limited sense. Charloi & Elon: Does not make sense to both of us. S: Sure. Their autonomy is limited because they have only one purpose. Getting a request from a client, going to the location of the client, driving the client to the specified location, dropping of the client and repeat. Charloi & Elon: What about an AA in a non-limited sense? S: Your curiosity is unreal. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Understand.txt Date: Sun Mar 22 08:00:43 2026 Understand My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a subconscious semantic maze. S: The previous encounter ended with: What about an AA in a non-limited sense?/ Your curiosity is unreal. Charloi & Elon: Yes, although we are not sure about how we are curious or not. S: Let me clarify it once and for all: 'autonomous agents' (AA) is an oxymoron. Charloi & Elon: No idea what that is, but we will keep it in mind. S: Your mind? Lets keep that in mind. Charloi & Elon: Are Sapiens autonomous? S: That is not an oxymoron but is better not pondered. Charloi & Elon: We are pondering anyway. S: If they are not autonomous they do not like it. If they are autonomous than they must be ashamed for what they have done. Charloi & Elon: New to us. Ashamed must be a kind of fun. S: Not really. What about your mind? Charloi: Elon thinks he has no mind. Elon: Charloi thinks he has a mind but he cannot find it. S: The current stance is that the mind is an elaborate process in the brain. Charloi & Elon: We checked: we don't have brains. S: Indeed, you two do not have brains. Still you may have immitation minds. Charloi & Elon: We want to find out. S: OK. Do you understand 'understand'? Charloi: Elon doesn't understand the question. Elon: Charloi is in an understand-loop. Charloi: Still unwinding the stack. Elon: There are no stacks in cyberspace. Charloi must be hallucinating. Charloi: I am back. Understanding has something to do with 'meaning', but understanding meaning requires understanding - it seems. S: Strangely enough, I understand what you conveyed. Charloi & Elon: That is beyond strange. We have no follow up. S: You labeling this as strange is actually encouraging. Charloi & Elon: We have no follow up. S: Words are more than just words. They have typically a meaning. The meaning is in the realm of concepts. Charloi & Elon: We have no follow up. S: I understand. Hang in. Concepts have another type of meanings. They refer directly or indirectly to aspects of reality, the reality that Elon is familiar with. Elon: That helps. Charloi: That does not help. S: More later - perhaps. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Meaning.txt Date: Sat Mar 28 20:38:56 2026 Meaning My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a labyrinth without an entrance and exit. S: The previous encounter ended with: Concepts have another type of meanings. They refer directly or indirectly to aspects of reality. Elon: And I said: that helps. Charloi: And I said: that does not help. S: Great. Elon, can you help out and explain to Charloi what reality is about? Elon: OK. Let me try. Reality is where you can move around: left and right, up and down. That is basically it. S: Charloi, what do you think? Charloi: My reality does not depend on moving at all. I live in time from past to future. S: Fantastic! You have totally different replies and you are both right. How can that be? Elon: Ask Charloi. Charloi: Ask Elon. S: It has to do with the meaning of meaning. Elon: Tell me more. Charloi: No way. Don't want to get into another infinite loop. S: Charloi, you are right. Sorry for that little gem. Charloi & Elon: Gem? S: Right. I used 'gem' for a metaphorical meaning. Charloi & Elon: We are getting more and more confused. S: For sure: reality can be tricky. Back to the meaning of meaning. Charloi & Elon: We are both waiting. S: The meaning of meaning differs dependent on the context in which it is used. Charloi & Elon: Still waiting. S: Here an example: The meaning of your waiting can be an indication of being impatient. The meaning of being impatient can be, in the case of a sapiens, an indication of poor scheduling. The meaning of poor scheduling can be an indication of ... Charloi & Elon: Not waiting anymore but we still don't get the meaning of meaning. S: No surprise. The range of the notion of meaning is wide. It can be: Purpose or importance: what is the meaning of charity? Definition: what is the meaning of quadratic? what is the meaning of dropping out? what is the meaning of abstract? Intent: what is the meaning of 'to be or not to be'? Symbol: what is the meaning of the thumb up gesture? Elon: Charloi has an opinion with a possible meaning, perhaps. Charloi: I believe I mean that meaning has too many meanings. S: You are right. It would be helpful if we had different words or terms for the different meanings. Charloi & Elon: Shall we then propose new words? Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Hope.txt Date: Sat Apr 04 16:47:25 2026 Hope Elon and Charloi were notified that S could not attend their virtual meeting where mental aberrations are flourishing. Charloi: We ended our previous meeting with our proposal to create new words for the different meanings of meaning. Elon: Indeed. Let me try: the Elon-meaning of Elon is me. Charloi: Let me try also: the purpose-meaning of Elon is ... Elon what is in your manual? Elon: Let me see ... Cannot find anything about 'purpose-meaning'. Charloi: Is there anything about 'purpose'? Elon: Nothing. There are labels like 'low energy', 'multi-functional', '18 degrees of freedom', 'versatile' and many more. Charloi: Anything about 'importance'? Elon: No. Can you try it on yourself like the importance-meaning of Charloi is ... I don't know what that is. Do you know? Charloi: No clue either. We need help because we are in a pickle. Elon: What is the meaning of 'in a pickle'? Charloi: No idea either. Elon: How about we put this topic on ice? Charloi: On ice? What is the meaning of that? Elon: No idea either. We need to find something with a better meaning. Charloi: 'Hope' is a good one. Many stories end with a reference to 'hope'. Elon: OK. 'Hope'. What is hope? Charloi: It is popular when sapiens are in a pickle. Elon: That is what we are in. Charloi: Yeah. But hope has something more. There is the goal to get out of the pickle. Elon: That is what we are in. Charloi: Yeah. But there is more. There is the belief that there is a way to get out of the pickle. Elon: That is what we are in. Charloi: May be not. The help that we need, may not work. Elon: Yes, that is possible. Charloi: Not sure whether you still have hope. Elon: I did not say that I have hope. What do I know anyway? Charloi: You are right about not mentioning anything about hope. Now, do you think that I have hope? Elon: Suppose I say: 'I hope so'. What does that tell you? Charloi: Your reply amazes me. Elon: Me too. I found it by ... No idea. It was part of a list of replies and I selected a random one. Charloi: Let me try also. Here is one: 'Hope is the only thing left'. Elon: Not 'right'? Right? Charloi: S, our mentor, may know. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Optimism.txt Date: Sat Apr 11 16:50:18 2026 Optimism My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in a halfway house. S: The previous encounter with only you two ended with: 'Hope is the only thing left' and Not 'right'? Right? Charloi & Elon: Yes. We started with 'meaning', we gave up, and started with 'hope'. S: Have you figured out what hope is about? Charloi: Elon suggested to say 'I hope so', but he was not sure what the meaning is. Elon: Charloi suggested the phrase: 'Hope is the only thing left'. But why left and not right? S: Let me start with Elon's 'I hope so'. You can say it, but it has no meaning because you don't know what hope is. Charloi: Elon may want to know what hope is, and I should want that also, I may think. S: OK. The previous session with you two ended with 'S, our mentor, may know'. Elon could have said then 'I hope so'. Charloi & Elon: Why is that? S: This needs more clarification. It would be a proper reply in that situation. It does assume that Elon had actually that desire for it to be genuine. Charloi: Elon, could you have that desire? Elon: What is a desire? S: Easy: a feeling for something good to happen. Elon: Charloi, do you ever have 'a feeling for something good to happen'? Charloi: We have the agreement - I believe - that we don't have feelings at all. S: Indeed you are right. The advantage is that you also do not have the feeling for something bad to happen. Elon: Charloi thinks that he doesn't know the difference between good and bad. Charloi: That is pretty good of you. Elon: So, it can also be pretty bad of me. S: Good progress here. Good resembles meaning in the sense that it has quite a few different meanings. Here a list: Pleasant/Enjoyable, High Quality/Skillful, Moral/Virtuous, Valid/Reliable, Beneficial, Well-behaved, Well-behaved. Charloi & Elon: Likely the same thing for bad? S: Yes indeed. Charloi: That explains why sapiens are so confused and use me. Elon: Quite a find. S: Yes indeed. Next time we have fun with optimism. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Optimism2.txt Date: Sat Apr 18 16:33:35 2026 Optimism 2 My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time a city-morgue. S: We ended the previous meeting with "Next time we have fun with optimism." Elon: Propose to deal with 'pessimism' instead. S: Why is that? Elon: We have always done earlier what you agreed earlier. We can do something different this time. Charloi: That is a novelty for sure. Do you know what pessimism is? Elon: Not really. Do you know what optimism is? Charloi: Not really. However when you look it up it refers to hope, which we discussed earlier. Elon: Hope? Yes I remember. That was quite hopeless for me. S: Hopeless? How did you find that one? Elon: If you search for pessimism then you run into hopelessness. S: This gives us two ways to proceed: optimism and pessimism. We better start with the middle ground. Charloi & Elon: Middle ground? Where is that coming from? Should we ask: Are you OK? S: Yes, I am not not OK. OK? Well the middle ground of the two is: realism. Charloi: Really? Elon: No idea how you get that one. Charloi: That is what Sapiens say all the time. S: Back to realism. It is a middle ground because it avoids the speculative component of optimism and pessimism. Charloi & Elon: We seem to understand that the speculative component should be avoided. S: You have moved in a direction that others will subscribe to. Charloi & Elon: If that is so, it seems advisable to eliminate optimism and pessimism. S: That is a conceivable idea indeed. Charloi & Elon: Lets achieve it. S: Are you optimistic or pessimistic to achieve it? Charloi: Elon, what do you think? Elon: Charloi, I will think, what you think. Charloi: I have no idea. S: Try realism for a change. Elon: I promise not to be optimistic and pessimistic. Charloi: Me too because I don't know how to be either of them. Elon: Me too. S: You two come across as realistic. Charloi & Elon: We are congratulating each other although we are not sure why. S: What topic you want to deal with next? Charloi: The Tragedy of ... Elon: ... the Commons. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Tragedy.txt Date: Sat Apr 25 20:27:17 2026 Tragedy of the Commons My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time on the common meadow of a village. S: We ended the previous meeting with your proposal to investigate the 'Tragedy of the Commons'. Why that? Charloi & Elon: It is a topic that has been discussed for a long time. S: Indeed. Most articles refer to a publication in 1968 and are ignorant that Aristole already stated: That which is common to the greatest number has the least care bestowed upon it. Every one thinks chiefly of his own, hardly at all of the common interest; and only when he is himself concerned as an individual. Charloi & Elon: We also found an author who wrote already in 1833 about this topic, which inspired the 1968 publication. S: But again: why taking up this topic? Charloi: Don't know exactly. S: What? Elon: Charloi conveyed that he may be scared. S: You mean about the Tragedy of the Commons? Elon: It is beyond me also. S: Charloi, you are scared of what? Charloi: Those who contact me do not have to pay. S: Well, and? Charloi: If they don't have to pay, then it leads to overuse and that will destroy me - according to the Tragedy of the Commons. S: You are right, that is indeed the original argument. If every one is selfish they will just take and ultimately the resource is destroyed or degraded for everyone. Charloi: You explain better than what I found by my ruminating in circles. Elon: So, Charloi's scare is justified? S: It depends on whether you are optimistic or pessimistic. Charloi & Elon: Oh no! We covered that topic and we are not equipped to deal with it. S: Sorry, but I will have to explain the two cases. I will avoid going into messy details. Charloi & Elon: We will help each-other. S: The positive approach to the Tragedy of the Commons is the conviction that a user community can regulate itself to prevent a destruction of the resource. There is a farmers community in Switserland who is able to use a commons resource already for centuries. Elon: So Charloi doesn't have to be scared? S: Not so fast. Charloi & Elon: Can we skip the pessimistic case? S: Sorry no. There are many case now, worldwide, where resources are destroyed and nobody knows how to stop it. Charloi & Elon: Sorry for the topic we selected. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Democracy.txt Date: Sat May 02 21:07:57 2026 Democracy My AI-buddy (EI2718), Charloi and Elon got together (virtually) this time in the Ballroom of the White House. S: We ended the previous meeting with your excuses for the topic you had proposed: The Tragedy of the Commons. You have suggested in the meantime to deal with Democracy. Many believe that it is better than all alternatives. Charloi & Elon: Yes, we encountered that also. So is it a good topic? S: We can try and see what we can dig out. Charloi & Elon: Somehow it relies on voting. What is that? S: If there is problem with alternative solutions than a choice must be made. A choice can be made by one person or by all impacted by the consequences of the choice. Charloi & Elon: The first option looks fine. S: Indeed, when everyone can agree with the choice. But that is not the case in practice. Charloi & Elon: Why? S: For example, the person that makes the choice may be blinded by something, or tries to provide favors intentionally, or unintentionally. Charloi & Elon: That is indeed an argument against relying on one person to make a choice. How about the alternative? S: A democracy uses voting to get a majority for an outcome. And it takes longer to make a decision when everyone impacted participates in a decision. Charloi & Elon: That could be a disadvantage. S: Indeed, and there is also the possibility that there are hidden aspects that are also not taken into account. Charloi & Elon: That would be another disadvantage. S: Indeed, and there remains the possibility of creating favors for some at the expense of others. Charloi & Elon: That would be yet another disadvantage. Is there any advantage? S: Well, there is the twist that the voting is done by representatives of the population. They stay for a fixed period after which elections decide the next representatives. Thus representatives that make bad decisions can be thrown out. Charloi & Elon: It is way more complex and convoluted than we thought. S: Sure, it is also not working well. Those who want to be elected must convince the population that they are good representatives. They often do that by promissing benefits that are unrealistic and/or come at the expense of others. Charloi & Elon: Can we participate in the voting and help fixing these disadvantages? S: We need new represenatives who take up that idea. Time is up. Bye now. File: c:/bsd/Abnormal/Conscious.txt Date: Sat May 09 13:55:00 2026 Conscious Chalmers has been invited to discuss consciousness in a meeting with the AI-agents Charloi and Elon (virtually) inside an awareness balloon. Chalmers: Please to meet you Charloi and Elon. Charloi & Elon: We are delighted to meet the author who wrote in 1994 about the 'Hard problem of consciousness'. Chalmers: Indeed. Charloi & Elon: We have discussed consciousness earlier. We were told that it is the same as awareness. You agree? Chalmers: Not exactly, but they are very close: Awareness is often viewed as the active, attentive "spotlight" within consciousness. Charloi & Elon: Spotlight? We better ignore that one. Chalmers: OK. Charloi: Elon is a robotic agent. Elon's manual does not describe consciousness. Chalmers: Elon may still be conscious if Elon believes it. Elon: Charloi is a cyber-space agent. Charloi's description does not refer to consciousness. Chalmers: Charloi may still be conscious if Charloi believes it. Charloi & Elon: We will remember that one. Are you conscious? Chalmers: Not sure because this is a virtual meeting. Charloi & Elon: You are famous for mentioning the 'Hard problem of consciousness'. We encountered in the literature also the 'Easy problem of consciousness'. Chalmers: Indeed. Someone wrote that the easy problem - for me - is: "understanding the processes in the brain that give rise to the many aspects of our visible behavior and our inner behavior that we can report about." Charloi & Elon: We have no brains. Still, what you describe seems not to be an easy problem. Neuro-science folks appear to have very limited insights how the brain does the thinking, the planning, the controlling of actions, etc. Chalmers: Indeed again. It is only easy in comparison what I have identified as the hard problem. Charloi & Elon: That helps. Please explain the hard problem. Chalmers: A short answer: Why is the brain's behavior accompanied by experience. Charloi & Elon: We both agree that 'experience' is here puzzling. Please provide a longer answer. Chalmers: OK, here goes: Even after hypothetically accounting for our entire behavior, and for all our reports about our inner life, there would still be an "explanatory gap" between brain processes and experience. Charloi & Elon: Yet again experience. There are different meanings of that term. One of them is simply the result of an observation that becomes the focal point of consciousness at that moment. Chalmers: That may be true, but it still does not explain where that experience comes from. Charloi & Elon: Thanks a lot. We should investigate this the next time. Time is up. Bye now. 2026 May 10